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3 litres of oil gone in 1.5 miles!

Davsurfa

Davsurfa

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Daventry
Car
2001 Accord se vtec
So the joys of this car hits me again. On the commute to work on Monday I noticed a small thin trail of oil leading up to my car in the works carpark. I thought 'That's not good!' and took a quick peek under the car to see a pool of oil about 12" long and 6" wide. I VERY gently got the car home to find a VERY big trail of oil behind me all the way!
Anyways today I've taken the valve cover off and cam belt cover off and got a better look. First thoughts were the head gasket had given up but after a chat with a mate who has 2 Civics and an Integra he seems to think its the cam seal.

On the plus side the oil is heading out of the engine rather than water heading in(if it had been the headgasket).

Has anyone ever changed a cam seal themselves? Is it an easy job or am I looking at a nightmare?
 
It's not too hard, but I guess it's not easy.

I think that you have to remove the cam pulley to be able to replace the camshaft seal. The problem is that you will have to remove the timing belt, thus having to install it after the seal is replaced, which invloves removing the lower timing belt plastic cover and reset the timing...

Not sure if you have to remove the engine mount...
 
A cam seal is a rather tricky job if you've normally one before.

Have a search on YouTube to see if there are any how to vids.
 
I could be wrong but that sounds like a lot of oil lost for a cam seal.
Can you see the oil leaking from the top of the engine?
If not I would be looking elsewhere.
 
It is the cam seal. The same thing happened to me. Was driving the car. parked it. left it for 5 mins and started it up again next thing 3 liters of oil on the ground. it is because the oil pump dumped everything out. I had to get Honda to do the job as it was a big one. The seal had to be replaced and the timing and balancer belt as the oil had seeped in and would have caused problems. Only happened 2 months after buying the car with 126,000 miles on it. in saying that replaced it and have had 1 1/2 years trouble free driving since.
 
You're obviously loosing a lot of oil externally. So first I would clean the engine and confirm the cause of the leak before attempting to undertaking any work. otherwise you could be wasting your time and money just fitting parts hoping you've got it right. It does seem like a lot of oil loss for a cam seal though.
 
Ok so the cam pulley is dry and on closer inspection it does look more like the head gasket. I'm now in the process of trying to get the head off. There are two nuts on the intake manifold one at each end at the bottom left that I can see.
On the plus side it's only cost me 1 knuckle and a scraped back of hand so far. On the not so brightside I can't buy just a head gasket I have to get the top end set which is £109 + vat. Kinda annoying as I have a complete gasket set except a head gasket.
 
25ba2820.jpg


I'm certain that seal shouldn't just be floating around willy nilly
 
All I know at the moment is its at the bottom of the engine. The picture was taken camera pointing down, the belt at the top of the pic is the cam belt
 
skhell said:
What seal is that? Can't get it in the picture
Click to expand...

After looking at the pictures I took when I replaced the timing belt, it seems to be the front balencer seal. It should be the left pulley in the picture.

EDIT: forgot to post the picture:
 
At least my head gasket is good! And as all the belts are quite literally dripping in oil they need changing anyways. I also get the chance to clean the bay up. Every cloud and all that
 
Most importantly I gotta figure out why it blew the seal in the first place. The car has done 140k and "fair wear and tear" doesn't convince me. Any ideas?
 
Hi Adam,

I looked over the invoices that Honda gave me for the work that I mentioned above. It was not the crank seal but the balancer shaft seal like yourself. The chap in the Honda garage said to me that apparently it happens quite a lot but would not give me a reason. Probably covering his a*s, He said that some have been known to come loose as a car is cornering hard. Sounds to me like the part does not fit as snugly as it should. One thing I will say is to make sure the new seal is snug and the balance shaft and belt are tensioned correctly. ever since I got the car back from Honda I have heard a noise that I can only describe as being akin to a diesel rattle, but the strange thing is that I can only hear it on the inside of the car and only between 750-3000 RPM. I have had the car back to Honda who refuse to accept it was their work, even though it only appeared after they had it. they tried to tell me I drove it too far with too little oil. I did not, only out of my garden and back in, and as competent as I am doing work on the car I will not go near anything that affects the timing. It has not affected the car in anyway but the noise is annoying, especially in cold weather.

Andy
 
The only thing it cames to my mind is that in the last time the balencer timing belt was not properly installed, making the balencer shafts not to be synchronized with the engine, which would produce extra vibration to the engine, thus forcing the seal to came out. It's a long shot, I don't know :huh:
 
Davsurfa said:
After a quick mooch online I find a blog, this one: http://bernardsblog.blogspot.co.uk/2008/09/honda-balance-shaft-seal-pop-out.html

Apparently this seal used to be a regular problem. I'm gonna try to make a retainer like in the second pic as I have some 1mm sheet steel laying around. Still gonna replace the seal though.

Reckon this is a good idea?
Click to expand...

If I new this a couple of years ago, I would put that retainer in the seal.
After searching a bit, found this topic, which has the honda part number for the retainer:
http://www.6thgenaccord.com/forums/showthread.php?p=888322

Go to Honda and show them this TSB, they should be able to get the part.
http://api.viglink.com/api/click?format=go&key=b8c2643c775d9228f7cdc1fdc65c23bb&loc=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.6thgenaccord.com%2Fforums%2Fshowthread.php%3Fp%3D888322&v=1&libid=1341749846925&out=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.tegger.com%2Fhondafaq%2Ftsb%2Faccord%2Fx00-073e.pdf&ref=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2Furl%3Fsa%3Dt%26rct%3Dj%26q%3D%26esrc%3Ds%26source%3Dweb%26cd%3D22%26ved%3D0CE8QFjABOBQ%26url%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.6thgenaccord.com%252Fforums%252Fshowthread.php%253Fp%253D888322%26ei%3DUXr5T_2OEdGChQfmj5TZBg%26usg%3DAFQjCNE79gjE5jiPr1btx5cFpzShBu8Nvw%26sig2%3DljxIqPSOVKrp3SGHGYNQig&***le=balancer%20shaft%20seal%20retainer%20-%206th%20Gen%20Accord%20DIY%20and%20Performance%20Forums&txt=TSB&jsonp=vglnk_jsonp_13417502797745

Also find the retainer on some online shops:
http://www.partsgeek.com/catalog/1992/honda/accord/engine_mechanical/balance_shaft_seal_retainer.html
http://www.theautopartsshop.com/engine-balance-shaft-seal-retainer/mtcw01331640107.html

Maybe you can find in the
 
It seems that Lings have the part:

http://www.lingshondaparts.com/honda_part_number_search_A10.php?partdes=+06923-P0A-306
 
Where's the fun in that!?! Making one can't be rocket science :) famous last words
 
I think Pedro has hit the nail on the head here. Adam replace the seal with a new one and when you do fit the retainer too. Job done.
 
did you left an old seal? its not a good idea if so...
I had the same problem before with h22a engine. and all I could figure out that it could happen because of bad oil filter - incompatible typ(used some kind FRAM filter, which was smaller that it should be). after changing new one I used glass glue as extra fix ant it never came out again.
 
At the moment the old seal is still in but the car won't be run until I have the new seal. I have to set the timing up now cuz I did try to start it but it ain't happening so the only thing I can think is the timing is way off
 
Unless i've missed something i don't see how the timing could be off.

If you want to check, take the cover off and ensure that the arrow on the cam gears are both pointing directly up. Not too sure how you could have skipped a tooth.

With regard to the balance belt, just take it off. A little lumpier at idle, but nothing to worry about. And it'll free up a couple of horses. :)

P.S I love the little 'retainer' you've made and fitted. Good work dude.
 
Because I was rushing to get it all back together and didn't check if the bottom pulley was tdc when I put the cam belt back on. Schoolboy error, I know!
One thing I did do was get the air con pump out though and the new belt fits perfects :)
 
New seal should be here at dinner so hopefully I'll be back on the road in the morning and won't have to walk to work anymore woohoo!
 
Fair play about the pulley mate.

Hope this problem hasn't cost you much to put right dude.
 
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