Jump to content


Photo

Diagnostic Scanners for 7th Gen


  • Please log in to reply
15 replies to this topic

#1 Channel Hopper

Channel Hopper

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 421 posts
  • Name:Stephen
  • Car :Accord 7 Estate 2005
  • LocationKT8 Postcode

Posted 18 May 2017 - 05:55 PM

Matt has kindly posted out his HDS to me for a final check on the ABS system before I throw some hard earned money at the steed.

 

Whilst I have the basic OBD2 scanner and Dr app which has done a stirling job of clearing down the historic manifold fault codes, the ABS/VSA is the next (and final ) stage though it would be useful for future checks in the event I keep the car for as long as the others, which has often been upwards of six years.

 

Matt's machine is allegedly very similar to this

 

http://www.ebay.co.u...1sAAOSwhOVXc9mR

 

though I will have to borrow the daughter's XP laptop to use it. It does mention Can-Bus operation though.

 

 

Slightly different though, Amazon were offering this unit up to yesterday, with more in shortly and it appears to have similar specification, including the mention ABS diagnosis and of Can-Bus operation. I don't however know whiich version of Windows it operates on, though a disc is supplied.

 

https://www.amazon.c...0?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

So , is the latter cheaper version likely to have similar performance for the Accord, or should I go for the Acura unit at £120 ?

 

Thanks in advance



#2 Channel Hopper

Channel Hopper

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 421 posts
  • Name:Stephen
  • Car :Accord 7 Estate 2005
  • LocationKT8 Postcode

Posted 18 May 2017 - 06:07 PM

Ah, just found the manual for the Autel 609

 

http://www.auteltech...8210449gv37.pdf

 

Page 40 onwards for the ABS, mention of European models as an option.



#3 Goodluckmonkey

Goodluckmonkey

    Advanced Member

  • TA Friends
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,433 posts
  • Name:Matt
  • Car :CN2
  • LocationKent

Posted 18 May 2017 - 06:48 PM

My HDS is as per the first link.
It's the best way to get everything done (once you've got your head around setting it up - took me a few evenings - there's a thread on here somewhere)
Gen 7 Pre-Facelift CDTI Tourer
Premier Tuning stage 2 map / EGR Delete
'09 N22A2 Civic motor / Accord 5 speed / Stock LUK Clutch and DMF
8.5x19 ET42 / 9.5x19 ET45 BBS LM fakes (225/35 and 245/35 Toyo's)
-35mm Apex Springs
Avg Consumption currently @ 44.5mpg

#4 Channel Hopper

Channel Hopper

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 421 posts
  • Name:Stephen
  • Car :Accord 7 Estate 2005
  • LocationKT8 Postcode

Posted 18 May 2017 - 07:09 PM

A few evenings ?

 

I better start bribing my daughter for her laptop then.

 

Can I borrow it for that long ?



#5 Cliffordski

Cliffordski

    Advanced Member

  • TA Friends
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,192 posts
  • Name:Cliff
  • Car :06 Tourer 2.4 EX man
  • LocationCounty Durham

Posted 18 May 2017 - 07:22 PM

Personally I'd go for the Autel all day long.

 

I bought a Shenzhen, it didn't read the ABS codes as promised, and it made the tailgate do the can-can for some reason !



#6 Goodluckmonkey

Goodluckmonkey

    Advanced Member

  • TA Friends
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,433 posts
  • Name:Matt
  • Car :CN2
  • LocationKent

Posted 18 May 2017 - 07:24 PM

As long as you need. I haven't used it in 18 months, and I only use the accord once a fortnight. Might plug the FRV in when I service it at the end of the summer. Hardly a rush.
Gen 7 Pre-Facelift CDTI Tourer
Premier Tuning stage 2 map / EGR Delete
'09 N22A2 Civic motor / Accord 5 speed / Stock LUK Clutch and DMF
8.5x19 ET42 / 9.5x19 ET45 BBS LM fakes (225/35 and 245/35 Toyo's)
-35mm Apex Springs
Avg Consumption currently @ 44.5mpg

#7 ukcl9

ukcl9

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 793 posts
  • Name:.
  • Car :CL7 Euro R,cl9 lpg
  • Locationuk

Posted 18 May 2017 - 07:36 PM

Ive fixed all my abs problem using a paper clip in pin 4 and 9 of the obd port and read the flashing lights
k20/k24 reflasher.Test ECU available.Click on the reflash thread
http://typeaccord.co...remap-test-ecu/

#8 ukcl9

ukcl9

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 793 posts
  • Name:.
  • Car :CL7 Euro R,cl9 lpg
  • Locationuk

Posted 18 May 2017 - 07:37 PM

Ive fixed all my abs problem using a paper clip in pin 4 and 9 of the obd port and read the flashing lights
k20/k24 reflasher.Test ECU available.Click on the reflash thread
http://typeaccord.co...remap-test-ecu/

#9 Jon_G

Jon_G

    aka 'Pepster'

  • TA Friends
  • PipPipPip
  • 4,459 posts
  • Name:Jon
  • Car :2005 Tourer i-CTDi
  • LocationNr Ludlow, Shropshire

Posted 18 May 2017 - 07:44 PM

Bear in mind that the HDS doesn't just read error codes. It can also run interactive diagnostic test routines for all engine sub-systems and also allows for replacement injectors to be coded to the ECU.



#10 Goodluckmonkey

Goodluckmonkey

    Advanced Member

  • TA Friends
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,433 posts
  • Name:Matt
  • Car :CN2
  • LocationKent

Posted 18 May 2017 - 07:50 PM

Ive fixed all my abs problem using a paper clip in pin 4 and 9 of the obd port and read the flashing lights


But yours isn't a diesel with the 'pump of doom'
Gen 7 Pre-Facelift CDTI Tourer
Premier Tuning stage 2 map / EGR Delete
'09 N22A2 Civic motor / Accord 5 speed / Stock LUK Clutch and DMF
8.5x19 ET42 / 9.5x19 ET45 BBS LM fakes (225/35 and 245/35 Toyo's)
-35mm Apex Springs
Avg Consumption currently @ 44.5mpg

#11 freddofrog

freddofrog

    Guess a Guest

  • TA Friends
  • PipPipPip
  • 6,290 posts
  • Name:Brian
  • Car :CM2 pre-facelift
  • LocationNLD triangle

Posted 18 May 2017 - 07:57 PM

The paper-clip method should fix it, and it it doesn't, anything else is unlikely to fix it.

 

Note as I said here --> http://typeaccord.co...ation/?p=243871  " On the 7th gen, HDS (or an ELM327) uses K-line.  There is a K-line connection to the MICU (which acts as a proprietary gateway to CAN which HDS can read but some ELM327 cannot read).  There is also a K-line connection to pin 23 on connector E of the engine ECU (not easy to find in the ESM) which is for direct reading of the engine ECU as provided for in the OBD2 standard (hence cheap generic readers can read the 7th gen engine ECU but nothing else)."

 

In other words, on the 7th gen pre-facelift (and probably the facelift) only the K-Line connection to the ECU is fully OBD2 compliant, the other K-Line connection to the MICU (which is the gateway to the other ECUs on the CAN) is proprietary

 

proprietary connection definition --> https://www.google.c...tion definition

 

Thus if you buy something that does not explicitly say that it can read the ABS etc on a 7th gen Honda Accord, then you may be disappointed.

 

Note also that HDS = "Honda Diagnostic Software", the unit that Matt sent you is actually the HIM = "Honda Interface Module".

 

The HDS is the software/display/human interface that runs on XP. 

 

To search on ebay, use "Honda HDS HIM"

 

edit: 

Note also that ELM327 is a chip -->  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ELM327 that can only read fully compliant OBD2 interfaces/protocols  and it is likely that most hand-held scanners use an ELM327 and simply have a display added on. So that Autel may be no better than the ELM327 and app that you already have.


Edited by freddofrog, 18 May 2017 - 08:03 PM.

sent from my Nokia 6110 using squawktalk


#12 Goodluckmonkey

Goodluckmonkey

    Advanced Member

  • TA Friends
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,433 posts
  • Name:Matt
  • Car :CN2
  • LocationKent

Posted 18 May 2017 - 08:03 PM

Yeah, it has all the software in there too, so I have actually sent the HDS.
(And a copy of XP just in case ;) )
Gen 7 Pre-Facelift CDTI Tourer
Premier Tuning stage 2 map / EGR Delete
'09 N22A2 Civic motor / Accord 5 speed / Stock LUK Clutch and DMF
8.5x19 ET42 / 9.5x19 ET45 BBS LM fakes (225/35 and 245/35 Toyo's)
-35mm Apex Springs
Avg Consumption currently @ 44.5mpg

#13 Channel Hopper

Channel Hopper

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 421 posts
  • Name:Stephen
  • Car :Accord 7 Estate 2005
  • LocationKT8 Postcode

Posted 18 May 2017 - 08:26 PM

The paper-clip method should fix it, and it it doesn't, anything else is unlikely to fix it.

 

Note as I said here --> http://typeaccord.co...ation/?p=243871  " On the 7th gen, HDS (or an ELM327) uses K-line.  There is a K-line connection to the MICU (which acts as a proprietary gateway to CAN which HDS can read but some ELM327 cannot read).  There is also a K-line connection to pin 23 on connector E of the engine ECU (not easy to find in the ESM) which is for direct reading of the engine ECU as provided for in the OBD2 standard (hence cheap generic readers can read the 7th gen engine ECU but nothing else)."

 

In other words, on the 7th gen pre-facelift (and probably the facelift) only the K-Line connection to the ECU is fully OBD2 compliant, the other K-Line connection to the MICU (which is the gateway to the other ECUs on the CAN) is proprietary

 

proprietary connection definition --> https://www.google.c...tion definition

 

Thus if you buy something that does not explicitly say that it can read the ABS etc on a 7th gen Honda Accord, then you may be disappointed.

 

Note also that HDS = "Honda Diagnostic Software", the unit that Matt sent you is actually the HIM = "Honda Interface Module".

 

The HDS is the software/display/human interface that runs on XP. 

 

To search on ebay, use "Honda HDS HIM"

Thanks. I always had my faith in the paperclip method as it cannot be challenged on a fault code basis, but I am up against the clearing down of each code as it appears.

 

So is Matt's Acura unit going to be any better than one that is 60% of the price for both working out Accord issues I have ? I can read electrical wiring diagrams and can probably best guess where a short or open circuit has occurred (and I was going to look at every image on the Accord workshop manual over the weekend to check the loom in detail).

 

I do have the base instinct that the Bosch unit is at fault and there are plenty on the auction site up for grabs. How long does it take for old for new replacement in Honda service hours btw , including fluids ?

 

The VSA switch is one of those anomalies that has come about only as a result of the testing procedure submitted, which suggests damage to the component but I have put things in place to remove the possibility of a misunderstanding of Honda's requirements that it is a third party switch at fault, and the question still remains on Pins 3 and 4 'continuity' within the loom.

 

Both diagnostic designs mentioned above run Win 2000 or earlier so I assume they are from a shared intellect of car design from the very late 90's, which would mean they are good enough for the average car user. but if you wish to move forwards then I can switch from UI to UX if this is how the discussion can progress, I can work in both.



#14 freddofrog

freddofrog

    Guess a Guest

  • TA Friends
  • PipPipPip
  • 6,290 posts
  • Name:Brian
  • Car :CM2 pre-facelift
  • LocationNLD triangle

Posted 18 May 2017 - 08:29 PM

The VSA unit is faulty Stephen, the sooner you accept that, the less effort you'll be expending in other (and futile) directions


  • Jon_G likes this

sent from my Nokia 6110 using squawktalk


#15 Channel Hopper

Channel Hopper

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 421 posts
  • Name:Stephen
  • Car :Accord 7 Estate 2005
  • LocationKT8 Postcode

Posted 19 May 2017 - 03:02 AM

Ok, I'll go buy a large pot of Dot X this tomorrow.

#16 honda_saj

honda_saj

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 693 posts
  • Name:sajeel
  • Car :honda accord
  • Locationlondon

Posted 21 May 2017 - 03:10 PM

My HDS is as per the first link.
It's the best way to get everything done (once you've got your head around setting it up - took me a few evenings - there's a thread on here somewhere)

I have setup instructions on pc at home will take you about an hour took me about that

Sent from my C6603 using Tapatalk

hope that helps post back and let us know so that others can benefit from the information

Regards,

saj