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Bit of an Electrical Issue!

S

Stratos

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Location
Worcs
Car
2008 i-CTDi Tourer
It appears I have a bit of a serious issue - hope not but it may appear so!
Whilst getting my car ready for the MOT and checking the relevant bulbs etc are working, I noticed that the rear fog was not working.
I checked the bulb and it had blown (or was not working) and replaced it with a known good one. Fog light still not working and no 12v supply at the bulb holder.
I removed the rear cover for better access and checked all connections - still nothing.
Checked the fuse box and there was NO FUSE??? - (when I purchased the car it had just passed an MOT??? - dodgy!!!)
Checked what the rating should be and found it should have been a 7,5amp fuse but I did not have any spares but I did have a 15amp fuse so for the purpose of getting the light to work I put this in.
Immediately, I heard a relay clicking in and so I went to the back of the car and found the bulb was illuminated - cracked it or so I thought!
With the bulb still lit, I replaced the rear panel but as I banged in the last plastic fastener the bulb went off??
I removed the panel again and the light was back on?? I played with all the connections within the rear panel and the bulb went off but I could not get the bulb lit again??
I went back to the front to turn off the fog light and check the fuse and very quickly noticed smoke coming from under the dash / steering wheel so I quickly turned off the ignition and checked the fog light fuse. It didn't appear hot??
I awaited for the smoke to clear and tried to start the car to check systems but the battery seemed to be flat.
Charged the battery and started the car. All appeared to be ok however, when I turned the car off and went to lock it I noticed I couldn't? I cannot lock it with the key nor by pushing down on the drivers side locking button?? Also, with the key in my hand, the dash is showing (orange key warning light) that the key is still in the ignition along with the warning alarm?? None of the buttons on the key fob now work nor for opening the rear tailgate.
I also noticed that the passenger n/s front door light was permanently illuminated now?? _ I have removed the bulb for the time being.
The car appears to drive ok and I can only lock the car by using the key in the door method but I'm not sure the alarm is activating??

Car is a 2007/8 i-CTDi Tourer.

Any ideas as to what is damaged??
 
Damaged MICU unit which controls onboard electronics by the sound of it..
 
F6HAD said:
Damaged MICU unit which controls onboard electronics by the sound of it..
Click to expand...
Just done a bit of searching as I've never heard of a Micu before and found this:

http://www.civinfo.com/forum/bugs-faults-irritations/35919-honda-civic-fuse-box-micu-recall-3.html

There appears to have been a recall on the Civic of the same age as my car.
Also, reading their issues there appears to be a simularity, I have a 4 year warranty battery that is ten months old and I have occasionally suffered with a flat battery especially when left for long periods.
Does the Accord have the same MICU fitted as the Civic? and
Where actually is the MICU fitted??
 
No idea on the problem, but I have put the circuit diagrams for my 7th-gen pre-facelift 2.4 Tourer here

MICU is diagram 15
 
Definitely the MICU unit / Internal Fuse Box although I'm struggling to get it out due to space & a loom with no give!!
I think once the Fuse Box is out, a replacement should be easier to fit.
However, my biggest issue is the state of one of the wiring looms going into the Fuse Box. One of the green (small) plugs that is fitted to the right side of the Fuse Box has got very very hot and welded itself to the socket / Fuse Box to such an extent that I couldn't crack the join so had to cut the wires.
On further examination, I can (feel at first) see that the wires from that plug are also in a real bad way in that there is no insulation and the wires are all bare and as such, will need cutting out and replacing however, I can only see so far when the wires disappear into the main loom up under the dash.

I guess my question to you is:
How far do you think the damage (overheated wiring) could/would go within the loom. Is the damage all I can see or do you think it's gone much further and has damaged the integrity of the whole loom. If so, am I looking at an insurance job??

Your help is appreciated.

p.s.
I did try to post pics but couldn't find how to??
 
Stratos said:
I did try to post pics but couldn't find how to??
Click to expand...
To upload photos you need an account on a photo-sharing website, list here on wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_photo-sharing_websites
When you have uploaded a pic to your chosen photo-sharing website, you put a link in your post to the pic
There's a good guide pinned in the Newbies section.(using photobucket, but similar procedure for any photo-sharing website)
 
I've never really heard of this issue before.. You're only going to know once you strip it all back
 
F6HAD said:
I've never really heard of this issue before.. You're only going to know once you strip it all back
Click to expand...
Only had a couple of hours to spare (in daylight) to have a look further. I have stripped the loom back as far as I can at present to try to see what damage there is.
Seems at the moment to be limited (further checks needed) to the spur off the main loom to the two green plugs that go to the right hand side (as viewed) of the fuse box.
The larger of the two plugs is ok however, the wiring is not as it is bound with the wires from the small plug. Two of the wires going into this green socket appear to have caused the issue.
These are: one of the red wires (there are two) and the purple or violet wire.
As yet, I do not have a wiring diagram for these two green sockets so cannot tell what circuits they supply?? If someone can help me with that it would be brilliant.
Also, when I removed the tape covering the wires so as to expose the wires, I noticed a blue connection on the red wires (see pics), is this standard Honda/Genuine?? - or is this another bodge from a previous owner???







 
Sorry, rubbish cut and paste deleted!

If I knew how to copy sections of my Honda manual and paste them here I would!
 
Jon_G said:
Sorry, rubbish cut and paste deleted!

If I knew how to copy sections of my Honda manual and paste them here I would!
Click to expand...
It depends what you're trying to copy and paste.

The web application that allows posts doesn't support html in the posts, so if you are trying to copy and paste something into a post from a browser, then most/all of the html formatting that gave the original appearance, will be lost. It's the same as trying to copy and paste from a browser into Notepad, all tabbing and tables just disappear. As you type, you might as well consider the web application as Notepad, except that it supports BBCode (bb-code). See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBCode

Some forum web applications support all of the BBCode features, whereas some support only a sub-set. You may have seen some forums that don't support images: those web applications filter out the "[ img ]" expression (and most "[]" expressions, in an attempt to prevent threads getting out of hand).

So ...... if you want to copy and paste something in a particular format, if the format is important, then the only way around it is to take a screenshot and post that screenshot as an image (using a photo-sharing website, which you know how to do).

The circuit diagrams that I uploaded to photobucket are (mostly) not screenshots ....I found a way to save the diagrams as .mdi and then converted .mdi to .tif (I won't go into that as it depends on the Microsoft applications that you do or don't have).
 
freddofrog said:
No idea on the problem, but I have put the circuit diagrams for my 7th-gen pre-facelift 2.4 Tourer here

MICU is diagram 15
Click to expand...
Thanks for the diagrams but not sure how relevant they are??
When I was googling what a MICU Unit was, the images between a Diesel and Petrol MICU/Fuse Box are massively different so maybe the diagrams are too??
I hoping the colours are not too far off though. I will try to go as far as I can with them so cheers.
 
^ big difference in loads of things sadly :(

if Jon is trying to paste from his 2.2 DVD then best to wait.

btw, I got my DVD from ebay for £30 a couple of years ago, but it's only for the petrol versions, Jon has the diesel version
 
Please don't wait for me... despite spending a fair bit of time trying, I'm afraid that I'm unable to post the wiring diagrams*.

Hopefully when you get a replacement MICU you can also get the damaged connector and a section of the wiring loom from that connector to splice into your vehicle wiring. I doubt there will be overheating damage elsewhere, as the overheating will have taken place where resistance is the greatest (usually a connector) between the feed and the short.

Whereabouts in Worcs are you?

*Brian - I can't do screen shots... it is as though the DVD is protected. If I block and copy, I can save as either .bmp or .png format files (not sure if I can upload these into TA?) but when I open these files only the 'main' items are shown, all lines showing the wires and ident legends have not been saved. Maybe part of the DVD protection again? I wonder if your DVD was previously 'cracked' to allow it to be illegally copied and sold?
 
Jon_G said:
*Brian - I can't do screen shots... it is as though the DVD is protected. If I block and copy, I can save as either .bmp or .png format files (not sure if I can upload these into TA?) but when I open these files only the 'main' items are shown, all lines showing the wires and ident legends have not been saved. Maybe part of the DVD protection again? I wonder if your DVD was previously 'cracked' to allow it to be illegally copied and sold?
Click to expand...
this is turning into "computing for dummies" :lol:
You don't know what a "screen shot" is, because you are right-clicking on IE and using "save picture as" ...which is not the same as "screen shot". To do the latter, you use the "PrtSc" button on the keyboard, but, press the "Alt" key first otherwise you'll get the entire screen. You then need to paste the clip-boarded image into something like Paint, and then save from Paint. However, the resolution of the screen shot may be blurred, depending on the screen size/resolution when you take the screen shot.
A better way, which I used, is to print the entire image from IE to an mdi file, then open the mdi in a microsoft application that can handle mdi files, then save as tif.
As for wondering if my DVD was previously 'cracked' to allow it to be illegally copied and sold, is the kettle calling the pan black. I know that the kettle is black, whereas the pan is actually very shiny with a glossy Honda print on the DVD and a glossy Honda instruction sheet in the DVD jewel-case. But anyway, the ***umption that a 'cracked' or 'non-cracked' DVD is behind the issue is borne out of a crack pipe dream.
 
freddofrog said:
...You don't know what a "screen shot" is, because you are right-clicking on IE and using "save picture as" ...which is not the same as "screen shot". To do the latter former, you use the "PrtSc" button on the keyboard, but, press the "Alt" key first otherwise you'll get the entire screen. You then need to paste the clip-boarded image into something like Paint, and then save from Paint. However, the resolution of the screen shot may be blurred, depending on the screen size/resolution when you take the screen shot...
Click to expand...
Actually, that's exactly what I tried to do first! It was only after that I tried the "save picture as..." option. :angry:

I take your point about unauthorised copies though. :blush:

I actually ventured into Worcs earlier today (Clows Top to Ombersley)... if I knew where Andrew was I could have then possibly dropped the DVD off on my way out, collected it on my return, and then made the IT issues someone else's problem! Maybe another time Andrew... I do go to Worcester sometimes, and other times through Worcs to Tewkesbury.

I genuinely hate IT... I'm supposed to be fitting kitchens and bathrooms, finishing re-wiring and re-plumbing the entire house, breeding goats and putting up fences at the moment. But I will try your suggestions when I get a spare hour and I'm in the right mood.
 
Jon_G said:
Actually, that's exactly what I tried to do first! It was only after that I tried the "save picture as..." option. :angry:
Click to expand...
I bet you didn't know what to do after pressing the PrtSc button :lol:

btw, Andrew might copy your copy :eek:
 
Jon_G said:
Hopefully when you get a replacement MICU you can also get the damaged connector and a section of the wiring loom from that connector to splice into your vehicle wiring. I doubt there will be overheating damage elsewhere, as the overheating will have taken place where resistance is the greatest (usually a connector) between the feed and the short.

Whereabouts in Worcs are you?
Click to expand...
Hello Jon,
I'm in Stourport-on-Severn. The car is stuck on my Moms drive in Astley Cross. I work in Kidderminster, right in the town.
I have the same thought path as you in that the damage should! be limited to the one area.
 
Hi Andrew - I'm actually just outside Cleobury Mortimer, so fairly close... if you do need the wiring diagram info we can easily arrange to meet so you can borrow the DVD.
 
Hello Jon,
Nothing as yet!
Loads of fuse boxes out there but none of them with the right code. Apparently, I need a: SEF-E44. There are plenty of SEF-E43 and other numbers out there but no idea what the difference is.

Your disc took a while to get into and once in I managed to find some of the wiring diagrams but not in a format I really understand too well. Especially as I'm looking to find a purple wire which goes into the affected green plug yet I cannot find a purple anywhere on any of the diagrams.

On a positive note, I'm hoping to be able to spend more time on the car from this weekend as I should be able to withstand more than ten mins at a time!!! ( I kid you not!)
 
Stratos said:
Hello Jon,
Nothing as yet!
Loads of fuse boxes out there but none of them with the right code. Apparently, I need a: SEF-E44. There are plenty of SEF-E43 and other numbers out there but no idea what the difference is.

Your disc took a while to get into and once in I managed to find some of the wiring diagrams but not in a format I really understand too well. Especially as I'm looking to find a purple wire which goes into the affected green plug yet I cannot find a purple anywhere on any of the diagrams.

On a positive note, I'm hoping to be able to spend more time on the car from this weekend as I should be able to withstand more than ten mins at a time!!! ( I kid you not!)
Click to expand...
Hi Andrew - Yeah, the DVD is a bit user-unfriendly until you've used it a few times!

Is it the cold weather that's the problem?... I've had to work on our Toyota recently (alarm keeps going off) and it is a bit chilly to concentrate for very long!

Good luck at the weekend.
 
I've had this virus now for over 4 weeks and it has affected my chest like I've never known before, something similar to pneumonia apparently. However, this week has been an improvement.
I've heard Saturday is ok but Sunday is rain!!
 
To all those who took an interest, my Accord is now up and running and fully functioning.
Yes I know it has taken nearly 4 months but that is down to trying to source a Fuse Box suitable for my car. Ebay shows many and the internet breakers are all keen to sell you something that doesn’t fit but eventually one turned up and once I had removed it from the donor vehicle and travelled back home, I connected it all up and ‘Everything Works’??
What did I do??
Well, from the photo’s I had taken – not much!! I repaired the wiring as much as I could see as I thought that a short would only attack a loom in one place and as I knew where that was and it was just about visible, I replaced all the damaged wiring.
All I can deduce from the whole episode is that there was an issue with the Fuse Box all along and not with the wiring as I could not see any major issues with the wiring. Just in case, I have fitted a LED bulb to the fog light to reduce the draw and fitted a smaller fuse but it works all ok anyway.
Like I mentioned in previous posts, the two main wires of concern seemed to be a red/white and purple. The red/white one could be related to the rear fog however, I have no idea what the purple wire does – even with a wiring diagram? - Thanks to Jon G for the loan of the disc.
The car now seems smoother and quieter (that’ll be in my head) and the rear sub now appears to work better?? – can’t explain that one either? but nonetheless, I’m a happy bunny!!
Total possible cost (Honda) of damage: £2627.43 + Labour
Actual costs (Me): £65.00 inc petrol + breakfast to my driver (Brother) for the lift!!

RESULT!!
 
Thanks for reporting back, and glad you fixed it!

Just goes to show.. Nothing is unfixable and never give up.
 
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