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Engine went into limp home mode and won't start

Honda Dave

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Hi All,

I was driving to work this morning when, the car went into limp home mode with check engine light, I pulled over turned off the engine and then tried to restart and it would not start, I noticed that the glow plug light was also flashing at this point and called the AA. who checked the faults and came with ;
P0087 Rail Pressure Too Low
P1065 Rail Pressure too low
P0340 Camshaft position sensor no signal
P0344 Camshaft position sensor open circuit / no signal

Although I was doubtful that it was the camshaft position sensor, the AA guy wanted to rule it out as the cause so we tried a new one and it did not fix the problem the car still does not start.
I've had the car towed to a local garage to fix and looking at the codes its a fuelling issue, any ideas what you think it might be exactly?
The car was serviced using genuine Honda parts and the fuel filter replaced by Honda themselves 4 months ago so should not be a filter issue . I've always run the car on V Power fuel in my ownership.

Any tips or pointers would be appreciated

Thanks in advance

Dave
 

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Honda Dave said:
Hi All,

I was driving to work this morning when, the car went into limp home mode with check engine light, I pulled over turned off the engine and then tried to restart and it would not start, I noticed that the glow plug light was also flashing at this point and called the AA. who checked the faults and came with ;
P0087 Rail Pressure Too Low
P1065 Rail Pressure too low
P0340 Camshaft position sensor no signal
P0344 Camshaft position sensor open circuit / no signal

Although I was doubtful that it was the camshaft position sensor, the AA guy wanted to rule it out as the cause so we tried a new one and it did not fix the problem the car still does not start.
I've had the car towed to a local garage to fix and looking at the codes its a fuelling issue, any ideas what you think it might be exactly?
The car was serviced using genuine Honda parts and the fuel filter replaced by Honda themselves 4 months ago so should not be a filter issue . I've always run the car on V Power fuel in my ownership.

Any tips or pointers would be appreciated

Thanks in advance

Dave
Sorry I have nothing tangible to help but I feel annoyed that this problem has occurred because it seems as though you've treated the machine well and it shows that this issue could happen to any of us.

I'm watching patiently for any updates.
 

Honda Dave

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Latest update from the garage is the bottom end is turning but the top end is not, so he suspects a broken sprocket or something that has caused damage to the top or is stopping the engine from running, he'll be opening up the top of the engine tomorrow, to see if this is the case and if so what damage has been done, hopefully not the case but we'll see.
The car has only done 86k
 

Channel Hopper

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If the car did not stop, but carried on with limp mode then I can't see the top end failure, well not a major one anyway.

Unless I have mistaken the engine for something entirely different, if you unscrew the oil filler cap and look inside with a bright torch, you should be able to see some of the top end mechanics turning (or not) when the engine is cranked over.

Don't wear a tie when trying this.

If the engine has done 86k then has the cam-belt just been replaced, or was it about to be ?
 

Honda Dave

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Hi there, yes this has been checked and no movement,the diesel has a chain not a belt, so generally doesn't need changing, there is no service interval for it, but was running perfectly before.
Yesterday as it went into limp home mode, it was struggling to run, hence I pulled over straight away and turned off the engine and would restart,car is still with the mechanic having the top of the engine off to confirm the cause.
 

Channel Hopper

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Apologies, I always use the term 'belts' for cars and 'chains' for motorcycles.

When I first bought the tourer, there was a thread with another member - John ? - who suggested earlier i-CTDIs and issues with the camchain system, one of the replies mentioned stretching beyond the tensioner limits that is difficult to identify until dashboard lights come on.

Search for 'ratchet' and 'tensioner'.

So, I'm ***uming either the two occurred almost at the same time, or you got the warning, stopped and then the process of starting the engine again snapped something under the bonnet (perhaps just jumping some teeth on one/both of the camshafts)
 

Grayedout

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From what's been written I presume it's the 2.2 icdti diesel engine?

If so then yes it has a chain not a belt. There are in fact two chains, one that does the camshafts and another that just runs the oil pump.

They are supposed to be fit for life but common experience is they do require replacement but 86k does sound quite early. They can normally be heard to be noisy which indicates they require changing.

The replacement is a major job as it involves dropping the subframe to allow the sump to be removed to change both chains along with all sprockets (I would also suggest replacing the oil pump sprocket as this is not included in a standard kit) but sounds like a worthwhile investment for your car.

Would then advise changing the oil every 6,000 miles rather than the standard 12,000.
 

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And a somewhat longer 2.2 thread from the Civic forum that has links to suppliers (and might have pictures on it).

https://www.civinfo.com/forum/engines-transmission-8g/115073-2-2cdti-timing-chain-replacement-2.html

which also has links to other sites,

https://h-tune.co.uk/club/threads/the-oil-pressure-light-of-death.8430/live

Post 5

Honda rectified the cause of the problem after 55 plate. To be fair it was their first Diesel engine. The Germans have been making them for years and they're just getting less and less reliable.
 

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Only now I recall the Saab 99T I had for a while also had a chain (possibly a Duplex version) that did have a service / replacement interval.

But it was such a long time ago.
 

Honda Dave

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Hi Channel Hooper and Grayedout
Thanks for all the links and replies, the car is a facelift so hoping the earlier fault was ironed out on mine,it had no chain rattle at all so no signs of stretch or additional noise. I had a bmw in the past that had developed a chain rattle which I got replaced, coincidentally a Saab 9-5 aero with a chain for 6 years was on significantly higher miles when I parted with it and was fine again no service interval usually yes if there is chain rattle which can't be cured with a new tensioner then a replacement chain is required.
I'm still waiting for the mechanic to get back to me so hopefully tomorrow I'll know more, if it has caused a lot of damage I'll have to probably to get a new car but we'll see(if so it'll be a petrol). The current thinking is a sprocket either seized or broke rather than the chain.
 

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Hi All, just a quick update,my mechanic confirmed the chain had indeed snapped without warning, so the car's not worth fixing, on the hunt for a new car at the moment, a shame as I got a lot things fixed on it but just one of those things I guess.
 

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accord_n22

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Sorry to hear.
That is definitely premature for the chain to snap at that mileage.
It could be the oil wasn't changed as regularly from previous owners.

What car you looking to get next?
 

Channel Hopper

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Looking through past posts, the car had a limp mode in June, though there were no symptoms at the time. It might be a camshaft did jump a link.

If only out of interest you decide to take the engine covers off, check if the tensioner is still in working condition.
 

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Oh no very sorry to read this Dave, that’s really some bad luck. The newer iDTEC cars have come down in price a lot, might be worth looking at one of these
 

Honda Dave

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Hi All, Sorry for the late reply, yeah that's the problem with used cars, even with service history you don't know if the right oil was used, whether the oil level was low for long periods, yep very premature to snap on this mileage. It did flash a limp home mode in the summer, but definitely didn't jump a tooth, i wouldn't have been able to drive it if it did.

I had to go on the hunt for a new car, I don't really need an estate or a diesel or 4 doors at the moment, so went for more cylinders instead haha and got a BMW e92 just the 325 but fun, will have its own issues in the future I'm sure, but for now it's running very well. Sorry Brett I should have looked in the for sale section as I know all the work you've put into your car.
 

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They’re lovely cars mate and if you’re not doing the miles then a petrol makes great sense. Hope it serves you well
 
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