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Strange battery/charging fault

Still no closer :( .

Running out of ideas other than taking the wiring loom out and checking it bit by bit. I have found some threads from an Oz forum that has the exact same issue but they always seem to end without conclusion though one owner printed off a voltage check over a driving period and found the reman alternator couldn't cope with the demands of the ELD, he's convinced that only an original Denso unit is up to the job. Leaves me wondering if I should either try a second hand one of eBay just to see or *gulp* drop another couple of hundred on a new Denso unit and one and for all rule out alternator issues.
 
I have noted that the OEM is rated at 105A and the reman I got 100A, really don't know if that could be an issue. I suppose it's down to how often it needs full amperage, though that would explain why the original reman I got did nearly nine months, unless I was just lucky?
 
I doubt if that difference of 5A will make any difference. ***uming that the alternator is the root cause, what is much more likely is either the mechanical or the electrical behaviour of the alternator.

I don't know for sure but I believe that the OEM alternator has a clutch (but no mention of it in the ESM). If it isn't Denso, maybe there isn't a clutch in the replacement one ?

The ELD unit sends a signal to the ECM (engine ECU) which has 3 outputs to the regulator (which is in the alternator). Purely guessing, there may be an incompatibility in signals sent from the ECM in certain situations ?

Have you tried braking while coasting (gear lever in N) ?
 
problem with the coasting is that I can't replicate it! I've never been able to turn around and do the exact same thing again and replicate the problem, it's that random.

I don't know how to conclusively prove it is the alternator without buying a new Denso unit (which I should have done in the first place). The niggle I've got is the fact that once I've had the charge warning the powered tailgate wont work from the key fob until the car has been left standing for a short while, it's almost like something resets itself. Struggling with this one!
 
I'd like to get to G302 as that seems an important ground but think it's tucked behind the bumper :unsure:
 
The EDL unit amongst others on the power side are grounded at that point.
 
yep it is behind the front bumper (LHS) adjacent to G301

In the ESM, put "engine compartment wire harness" (without quotes) into the search box.

G302 is also for the windscreen wipers and blower motor, so next time it happens try the windscreen wipers and blower
 
I've tried that but it happens so quick! I have the workshop manual and I've been tracing the wiring looking for culprits however I'm coming to the conclusion that the ELD isn't 100% with remanufactured alternators. I'm saying this because the US and Oz forums have far more experience with this problem and everyone seems to have happened after the original alternator has been replaced with a reman unit, those that have used a Denso unit don't seem to have an issue.
 
StuH said:
I've tried that but it happens so quick! I have the workshop manual and I've been tracing the wiring looking for culprits however I'm coming to the conclusion that the ELD isn't 100% with remanufactured alternators. I'm saying this because the US and Oz forums have far more experience with this problem and everyone seems to have happened after the original alternator has been replaced with a reman unit, those that have used a Denso unit don't seem to have an issue.
Click to expand...
If it is due to the fact it's not Denso, then it must be incompatibility with the control signals from the ECM, and/or I'd also suspect that there isn't a clutch in the alternator. I've always been puzzled about this clutch in the alternator, I've always thought that it must be there for when the engine is being started to reduce load on the aux belt. Maybe it's also supposed to do the same thing when the engine rpm is being artificially reduced by braking, possibly the ECM also cuts the signals to the regulator.
 
Well I'm soon going to find out as I've ordered a Denso OEM unit :blink:. Given how often I'm reading reman units are very hit and miss and given that Honda's can have problems with non-OEM parts it's the only way I can rule out the alternator.

I wasn't actually aware they had a clutch, is it in the pulley? I wonder what my reman part has?
 
Honda cars have no more problems with aftermarket parts than any other manufacturers. That's a baseless myth widely pushed on another Honda forum by people who don't have the knowledge, experience and/or confidence to buy parts and services from elsewhere. Plenty of manufacturers supply parts at least as good as OEM, often better (admittedly there is also a lot of poor stuff about, so you do need to have some grasp of what you're buying).

You could have had your alternator electrically checked out before binning it, perhaps by an auto-electrician.

On diesel models, the overrun clutch IS in the pulley. Not sure about yours.
 
Jon_G said:
Honda cars have no more problems with aftermarket parts than any other manufacturers. That's a baseless myth widely pushed on another Honda forum by people who don't have the knowledge, experience and/or confidence to buy parts and services from elsewhere. Plenty of manufacturers supply parts at least as good as OEM, often better (admittedly there is also a lot of poor stuff about, so you do need to have some grasp of what you're buying).

You could have had your alternator electrically checked out before binning it, perhaps by an auto-electrician.

On diesel models, the overrun clutch IS in the pulley. Not sure about yours.
Click to expand...
I've started a new thread on this --> http://typeaccord.co.uk/forum/topic/23655-honda-cars-have-no-more-problems-with-aftermarket-parts-than-any-other-manufacturers/

But it does sound as if the fault is due to the alternator (either no clutch or incompatibility with ECM signals to the regulator in certain situations).

What brand name is on the alternator ?
 
There isn't a brand on it, it's just a remanufactured one I picked up locally.

As for having it checked, I've done that, it tests fine, it's only certain circumstances the fault occurs. I can show you countless threads I've saved from other forums were reman alternators have failed out of the box.
 
And plenty of people have fitted aftermarket alternators and been happy with the outcome.

I'm thinking you have a problem elsewhere with your vehicle electrics. But I hope I'm wrong and the new OEM alternator works ok.
 
^ quite pertinent where it says ....."there have been many cases where the charging system will pass a performance test and still have a charge warning lamp on. In most cases, design variations are the culprit and most technicians prefer to use OEM alternators to avoid erroneous charging light problems"
 
It came thins morning and I dropped it in a lunch time. The Denso is clearly a better made unit than the one it's replaced and it says 'Made in Japan' so that always gives you some confidence! Has it solved it? don't know, too early to say but I feel better having the genuine article. Interestingly, the marker for the belt was off to the right with the old alternator but with the new it's bang on centre, probably means nothing but there you go!
 
Been out for a good drive, used the voltage meter in the accessory socket for constant readings. Previous alternator reading would be around 13.6 - 13.7v dropping to the 12's or lower which would cause the warning. New alternator is reading 14.0-14.1, it momentarily drops to 13.8v in those situations that would previously cause the warning but it'd immediately rise to 14.1 again. Don't want to tempt fate but looks like it's performing better.
 
Still good and after reprogramming both keys the boot is working fine again. Fingers crossed.
 
It's certainly looking better than it did seven days ago! Picked up some Honda PSF today, will be the next job.
 
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