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Water in rear pass. footwell

S

smooges

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Location
Kilkenny, Ireland
Car
7th Gen Diesel
After a heavy shower Monday night went out to the car in the morning to find rear passenger footwell with a good inch of water in it. No other area in the car is wet. My son had said to me over a week ago that he noticed it being very wet but I just ***umed it was wet feet from the kids. I can't see any obvious places for the water to enter. All the door seals seem in good order and in place. I do have a sunroof but ***umed the drains ran to the front of the car. This has only started in the last few weeks as we've had plenty of rain in Ireland over the summer and would have spotted this before now.

The only thing to have happened recently was a front collision with a dog. Both radiators, aircon and front bumper had to be replaced. Don't know if this could be in any way related. (btw dog is fine).

Any suggestions as to where to look would be appreciated.
 
Sunroofs usually have 4 drains one in each corner so it could be one is blocked, park the car so all the water will run down the rear drain of the side where the footwell is wet and open the roof and pour water into the channels and see if it drains away and whether it appears in the footwell.

Otherwise its pressure wash car and sit someone in it and see if they can see anything.
 
I've attached a diagram of the sunroof mechanism to show the drain channels on it.
sunroof

With that much water in the car I thought it should be easy to trace the leak by following the water marks left by it. But saying that that amount of water soaking the carpet could hinder initial investigations. I would try removing some trim panels to trace the leak.

I take it the water is fresh water and doesn't contain chemicals as in the case of coolant??

I would start by making sure the sunroof drain channels and pipes are located correctly and clear.

But if the sunroof is closed and secure surely there should be no water ingress into the car to run down the drain channels?! Unsure!! Maybe someone else can clarify this!

I would doubt an accident of that magnitude would cause the water leak.
 
Thanks for the prompt replies. I just tested the sunroof as suggested. Car on a slope, sunroof open and sure enough I could see water coming in through the rear pillar at the point of the airbag tab. So it's obviously snaking it's way to the footwell. Water also came out of the rear passenger drain hole under the car. Looking at the picture of the drain layout it looks as though it's in sections and therefore my drain must have come loose at a junction.

It is odd though how so much water can get in to the car with the sunroof closed. Should this much water be able to seep through the seals or do they need replacing?

Do you know if I can get access to the drains behind the trim and if so is there a particular way of removing same?
 
You could have a slightly blocked drain I did have this problem on my old Civic it did drain water but couldn't cope with heavy downpours and thus started leaking from the joints of the drain tube.

Not quite sure which trim your on about as I have a tourer but the trims are usually just clipped on, you'd have to pull the door seal back first. Also look for any covers that could be covering bolts.

Someone may have a better idea of how to get the trims off.

If you can see where its draining from the drain hole under the car see if its a bit clogged up, I suspect once you clean the drain hole it'll drain fine and not leak from anywhere else.
 
I would expect the seal to stop most if not all of the water. Yours certainly doesn't sound like it is doing that. The seal could be worn or the sunroof may not be seated properly and need adjustment. It should be flush with the roof in all the corners.
 
Good info!
I too get the occasional puddle on the rear mats, usually after light hosepipe use.
I've somewhere to start looking now...
 
Unfortunately this problem is persisting. My wife had the car for the weekend and when she came back there was a swimming pool in the back of the car. There is also water in the front pass. footwell but this could have poured in from the back under braking. I had thought the water was coming in through the sunroof drain channels as suggested but this area is dry. In fact everywhere seems dry except the floor. I have sat in the car during heavy rain and can't see any water ingress just the pool of water rising.

Is it possible that the water is coming through the drain channels under the black roof trim?

Any suggestions appreciated, otherwise I'm putting a few goldfish in there.
 
I'd try pulling the plastic trim off round the carpet and up the centre and rear pillar, they only clip on, to see if you can see where the water is running down. Failing that I'd go one stage further, it's extreme but considering how bad the problem is, I would lift the carpet in the rear to expose the cars floor then expose the car to lots of water and watch and wait. It's not the subtlest way but it will get you a definitive answer and may turn out to be quicker in the long run. Plus with the trim already removed the problem should be easier to get to to fix.
 
Thanks for the reply.

I'll have a go at removing some of the trim tomorrow.

Hopefully I won't break too many clips.

I'm a bit reluctant to remove the carpet but if it's the only way to get to the bottom of this so be it.
 
You shouldn't need to remove the carpet in all honesty, it sounds like the leak is so big finding it shouldn't be a issue. The plastic trim round the carpet comes off by lifting it upwards it's held on by the same type of clips which hold the door cards on. The centre pillar trim is held on by the same clips.

If you do have to go to the lengths of moving the carpet, it stops just behind the rear seats before the boot. The lower part of the rear seat lifts up out its clips, there's 2 clips, 1 each side at the front under each seat if that makes sense. It may need a good tug to get it to release but they do just pull out. There's also a bolt at the back then it should lift out. That should give you enough room to lift up the carpet for a good look.

These diagrams may help you work out where the clips are.
diagrams
 
Sorry to resurrect and old thread.

Did you ever get to the bottom of this? I've just had exactly the same issue. Although, I do not have a sunroof. My back passenger side foot well visibly soaked, and had a little standing water too. Everywhere else surrounding it, including the vertical pieces of carpet at the door and under the back seat were completely dry. The first time it happened it was after the "hurricane" up here a few weeks ago and then again just over christmas during high winds and rain. Although it did rain for the next few days afterwards it didn't seem to get much worse.

I've been out with buckets of water, and nothing, haven't been able to find any sign of water leaking in anywhere. I've read quite a bit here and various places. I was expecting with the quantity of water that has got in, it would have been pretty obvious where it was coming from. Would the membrane leaking, allow water to leak in behind the seals and carpet ie. No visible leak trail on the interior?

I'm suspecting the wind has probably separated the felt seal from the window and the membrane inside the door is loose. It's the only thing I can think of.
 
It's interesting you have this issue as well without a sunroof.

If the water was getting in past the window felt I would have thought the water would drip down into the bottom of the door and out the drain holes. The door seals are higher than the drain holes so the water stays on the outside. I would have thought also that the membrane would be far enough away from the water dripping off the bottom of the glass to not run down the membrane and into the inside of the door, otherwise this could cause a real issue with a lot of owners over time. If you are getting leakage past the membrane is the door card wet?
 
Doc said:
It's interesting you have this issue as well without a sunroof.

If the water was getting in past the window felt I would have thought the water would drip down into the bottom of the door and out the drain holes. The door seals are higher than the drain holes so the water stays on the outside. I would have thought also that the membrane would be far enough away from the water dripping off the bottom of the glass to not run down the membrane and into the inside of the door, otherwise this could cause a real issue with a lot of owners over time. If you are getting leakage past the membrane is the door card wet?
Click to expand...

No everything as far as I can tell (without removing the door card) is bone dry just wet carpet in the rear passenger foot well. The door appears to be draining correctly, via the drainage holes.

No noticeable water staining on the roof, no obvious water has been flowing in markings on any of the interior, the boot is bone dry. The water is clean and tastes a little salty, just like rain water.

In this link: http://typeaccord.co.uk/forum/topic/2440-leaking-door-seals/ (really shocked that this is honda's method of keeping us dry to be honest)

I would ***ume that if water does get passed the felt (which may only happen in high winds)... it's getting down behind the membrane as it should, but the membrane may be loose at the bottom. At this point in the door, i think your actually inside all of the door seals, which would possibly let the water in under the plastic trim that joins the carpet. It's the only way that i can thin that water could get in without any trace, especially given thats pretty much where it initially pooled on the carpet.

I've got it booked into the dealers on Tuesday to be looked at, the guy at the service desk looked at me like i was mental or he had never seen a honda leak... If they get to the bottom of it, i'll let you know.
 
Took another look while i was hoovering it out for it's trip to the dealers, pretty sure its the membrane thats leaking or somewhere around the bottom of the door seal. Where the door card meets the metal, the metal is wet and there is a puddle in the foot grip on the doorway. No other door is either wet at the doorcard join or has a puddle in the foot grip.

Wee Honda Jazz for a courtesy car in the morning, should be fun!
 
Sure it's not the door seal and the water is just running to the lowest point?
 
Day 1 Garage Update : "Your car is very wet inside, were trying to dry it out so we can trace the leak, it is quite bad".... We'll need to run over into tomorrow, hold on to the courstesy car.

Cool, at least we've established there is a leak and it's indoors getting dried out. Hopefully if its that bad a leak or a severe problem then Honda UK might be interested in it.
 
Day 2: Cant find any leak "are you sure you didnt leave the window open", yes im sure, everything else is dry, wouldn't you think if i left the windows open the seats would be soaking too? I've referred them to the door membrane... check it please.

BUT your back brakes are seized, down to the metal and scorched the discs (£260), they felt fine yesterday, didn't look scorched and certainly were not exhibiting any sort of metal on metal noise. and a ball joint needs done ( i knew about that).
 
Well they should only be £250 on Honda Happiness anyway the discs and pads! Keep us posted if they find anything.
 
Sorry to hear you're having the same problem as myself. It is incredible how much water can get in. After a heavy shower the water seems to just rise from nowhere. The carpet around the water is dry and there are no signs of water marks anywhere.

I did have a go at removing a piece of trim. I pulled the piece on the seatbelt pillar but it wouldn't go back in to place so I gave up on that.

It'll be interesting to hear how you get on with the garage, that is, if they can focus on the job at hand.
 
sc66 said:
Sorry to hear you're having the same problem as myself. It is incredible how much water can get in. After a heavy shower the water seems to just rise from nowhere. The carpet around the water is dry and there are no signs of water marks anywhere.

I did have a go at removing a piece of trim. I pulled the piece on the seatbelt pillar but it wouldn't go back in to place so I gave up on that.

It'll be interesting to hear how you get on with the garage, that is, if they can focus on the job at hand.
Click to expand...

Well they've been working on it for 2 days... and have found nothing. I did notice something weird on one of my door seals and i'm wondering maybe if by moving it, i sorted the problem. If you open your door. look at the seal on the door right at the bottom, is it sagging in the middle of the door and covering the big drainage hole? My theory (based on the fact some bloke has been showering my car for 2 days and found nothing) is that the bit of seal that was hanging down obstructed the drainage hole and cause water to ingress into the cabin, now, it hasn't happened again since i moved that seal about 1cm up away from the big middle drain hole.

Just waiting on them calling me back with the final bill.... have a feeling this is gonna hurt!
 
Just fixed this problem on my 03 saloon.
Drivers door (LHD) plastic membrane behind door card was detached at the bottom, cleaned & refitted with fresh sealant,
no more water in rear well even after torrential rain, :D
 
They have found a leak. It's apparently a rubber grommet. On the dealer waiting on a full report. More later.
 
Report "Check for water ingress from rear seat ares, resealed grommet at NS bulkhead/footwell, test ok"

Total Bill forDiagnosis, fix, new rear discs and shoes and 2 new light bulbs £398 inc Vat

N/S/R top ball Joint on order, fitting on tuesday £187

Could have been worse, seeing as they spent best part of 2 days trying to find it.
 
Just to let you all know, following some torrential rain, some deliberate puddle splashing etc over the last week. Nice dry carpet, the fix is good.
 
tribalscribble said:
Just to let you all know, following some torrential rain, some deliberate puddle splashing etc over the last week. Nice dry carpet, the fix is good.
Click to expand...


That's great news Chris,

Also thanks for keeping us updated, whilst obviously you felt the pain in the wallet, hopefully this will prove useful to other members, just hope that should you need anything else solving, the answer is already on here for you.
 
CJM said:
That's great news Chris,

Also thanks for keeping us updated, whilst obviously you felt the pain in the wallet, hopefully this will prove useful to other members, just hope that should you need anything else solving, the answer is already on here for you.
Click to expand...

No probs :)
 
tribalscribble said:
Just to let you all know, following some torrential rain, some deliberate puddle splashing etc over the last week. Nice dry carpet, the fix is good.
Click to expand...
Good to hear you got it sorted. You'll have to find somewhere else to keep the gold fish now. :)
 
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