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Upgrading the Accord iCDTi ICE. Many Questions (& hopefully Answers too!)

we can come 4.30 to Ace cafe car park.It's on website.
 
I will try to get up there if I am not too tired.
 
Firstly sorry to the Ace Cafe meet guys, I was just too tired after working till 4am, then up early to work on the car today. I had fully intended to come but was wasted.

A few bits & pieces finished off today, no time for pictures unfortunately, it was too cold to hold the camera steady.

Door Bins
Lined the inside of the door bins with a layer of Closed Cell Foam
(Prevents any bits & pieces jangling around)

Power Cables & RCA's
Run Power Cable from the Fuse Box to under the driver seat plus an RCA Phone lead for the amplifier that will drive the rear door component speakers. This is a JL Audio A2150 providing 2x 75Wrms, this allows my 300/4 to run in bridged mode 2x 150Wrms to the front speaker set up. Watch for a somewhat different & slightly unique solution to the front sound stage than the Lexus, which had stock location Mid/Bass Woofers in the bottom of the doors, with tweeters mounted in stock pods behind the mirrors. You won't see any difference other than the Honda tweeter stock location is in the corners of the dash near the windows.... More of this when the car is finished......

Ski Hatch
Yep. I took a Dremel to the area behind the rear arm rest to make a Ski Hatch/Bass Port. As I fully intend to keep the car for at least a few years yet, this was the only solution. With the rear 6x9's removed & this extra port, there will be very little obstruction for the bass flow into the cabin. Some cars systems are deliberately designed so the car can be heard streets away. Mostly they don't live up to the hype inside when you get a demo. As this car was designed to keep me happy, & as I sit inside the car, that is where I have focused the sound. If you can hear it outside then great, but that's just a bonus for you. I want the sound to be focused on those lucky enough to hear it from the inside.

A big shout to my buddy Lukhvir (Y2Kanjar from LOC/OJC) for his help & use of his sheltered driveway today. If I win the lottery I will deffo buy a big house with a double or even treble garage. Working outside today was fine, the sun was out. Then all if a sudden my hands just started freezing up, which then spread to my core very quickly, so we had to retire to his nice warm house stopping any further work for now.

Mission impossible is very nearly achieved.......
 
Remember there are 2 main types of ICE builds these days, SPL (Sound Pressure Level) or SQ (primarily Sound Quality based, flat EQ, volume levels are far far lower but faithful reproduction is the key). This is more towards the SQ kind of build, but with added balls, so crystal clear clarity and fairly decent volumes with a good dollop of tuneful bass. By that I mean basslines are followed with some accuracy albeit at fairly loud levels. Lots of cars will go louder, but they certainly won't sound as clean as this does across the frequency range.

So the good news is it's finally finished. Well kind of. It's all in fitted & working but there are a few cosmetic bits needing attention. These will all get done over the next couple of months as it gets warmer, and are already paid for etc, it's mostly just a question of tidying up & finishing off.

1) A Battery Box for the boot install needs to be made from sheet aluminium & carpeted.
2) Under Rear Seat still needs to have the Silent Coat applied.
3) A custom fit Perspex Panel covering the Amplifiers needs to be made & fitted, with JL Audio Decals.
4) Re do Amp Rack. I'm going to hide away the cables underneath. Quite a rigmarole but will tidy the look up.
5) The temp Ski Hatch needs finishing off so it's visually perfect.
7) Driver's cubbyhole has 2 bass controllers in and the infra red control for the TV tuner, so it needs a mounting plate cut & custom fitted to tidy it all up inside.
6) Courtesy LED's in front doors & footwells.

So how does it sound? Initially it was impressed, then maybe a little disappointed. Then a few crossover tweeks, measuring path lengths to my ears in my driving position, time alignment dialing in and corssover adjustment then it was just like WOW!! We have CD, Mp3, iPhone, DVD, Freeview TV, DAB Radio, Handsfree Bluetooth & Reverse Camera. Oh & Sat Nav, I nearly forgot that. There are 11 Speakers, 3 Amplifiers, & one very happy driver!! A good week or two running in the speakers inside the cabin, then more gain levels & crossover tweeking, & finally then some EQ to my own personal preference (which is totally flat so far).

Here is a system diagram with how it all eventually ended up.


So what is in the install?
Pioneer F-60DAB Head Unit/Sat Nav
Alpine TUE-T150DV DVB-T TV Tuner
Alpine KRE-500E Remote Eye
Alpine KAE-210DV Amplified DVB-T Tuner Aerial

JL Audio 1000/1 Amplifier (driving)
JL Audio 12W7-3 Subwoofer

JL Audio 300/4 Amplifier (driving)
JL Audio C5-650 Dash mounted Tweeters
JL Audio C3-650 Front Component/Coaxials

JL Audio A2150 Amplifier (driving)
JL Audio C2-650 Rear Components

Pyle PLCM HONDA Infrared Rear Camera
Silent Coat Bulkpacks 3x2mm & 1x4mm
CCF Self Adhesive Decoupling foam 9mm & 3mm
0awg Power & Ground Cables
4awg Power & Ground Cables (Sky High)
0agw & 4awg Terminals
Plastic Conduit trunking
KnuKoncept 0AWG Battery Terminals (2 sets)
KnuKoncept KNF-60 Fused Distribution Block
KnuKoncept KNF-36 Fused Distribution Block
KnuKoncept 8AWG x2 Subwoofer Cable

Technical stuff
After a quick listen to 2 of JL Audio's official demo cars, my original plan to use the C2-650 Speakers as my front had to be changed. As with all manufacturers there are base model speakers, then as prices increase as does the quality & the technology along with performance. The C2's retail at around £150 now, (£190 when I bought them), and although they are a step of from the Alpines I had in the Lexus, they then were clearly outclassed by the C3's.

The C3's are an interesting engineering solution. They are a convertible coaxial/component system, so in effect they can be used as a drop in speaker replacement with the Tweeter mounted inside the front of the Woofer like this....


or they can be detached (literally unscrewed) and run separately as a Woofer & Tweeter and mounted in separate locations

leaving the Woofer with a supplied phase plug


They have an externally mounted crossover to split the frequencies between the speakers in either mode


JL Audio ran these with the tweeter attached in their demo cars as they feel it provided better imaging with the drivers closer together, and after listening I had to agree. They also ran in the centre of the dashboard another set of tweeters to help lift the sound more up to ear level, in a ghost tweeter arrangement. As I wanted a stealthy look I decided to do this with the incredibly HQ C5 Tweeters, but hidden in the stock locations in the far corners of the dashboard. This has worked out incredibly effective, as although they are running at approx 3dB lower than the C3's, it is just enough to raise the vocals up to head level, & tbh with them seperated the soundstage imaging is pretty awesome even if I do say so myself. The C5 Tweeters & adjustable crossovers, note the jumper bars for adjusting the tweeter volume so they integrate as needed.



C2's (originally going in the front)

So the C2's got relegated to the rear doors, these only run for effect when I am alone in the car, so are backed down to around a third volume to just provide something known as rear fill. Only when I have rear seat passengers in demo mode they get some more volume. The sound should always come more from the front as you simply don't go to a concert, & then turn your back on the main stage.....They still sound pretty awesome but are outclassed by the newer C3's in the front door. As my 300/4 was now running in 300/2 mode, the C2's power demands are provided by another JL Audio Amplifier; [SIZE=14.3999996185303px]a A2150 (eBay you godsend), which takes up every inch under the driver seat & provides up to 75Wrms to each rear door.[/SIZE]

Not any room at all under the drivers seat now lol



So a few bit's and bobs to do over the next month or two after it's all given a final dail in, but thankfully spending money is now over, which is lucky really as that coincides with me having none ha ha

Anyone local to London that just wants to hear a demo, message me as I will be at a Lexus *(cough cough) meet towards the end of February in NW London, or just PM me and we can sort something else out that suits you.
 
So here's a few pics, not much to show really as everything is pretty much hidden except for the Rear Door Tweeters, and unless you looked for them, from outside the car you wouldn't know there was anything different other than the head unit, and again you wouldn't even see that in passing....

C5 Tweeters behind factory grills


C3 Component Coaxials behind factory Front Door Grills


C2 Component set in the Rear Doors


Head Unit in my highly modified facia with modded radio surround


A bit of TV whilst parked up
 
Very impressive
 
So I started tackling another job I haven't had time for recently. The remote controls for the JL Audio Bass Amplifier plus the Audio Control Epicentre we're routed thru to the driver dash cubbyhole.


However I obviously wasn't happy with them just sitting loosely inside as they not only looked untidy, but also were difficult to use as they were not anchored in any way so I hatched a plan.


£4 worth of eBay black Perspex later & the idea is taking shape....


A quick measure


No bandsaw at home so out came the Dremel again and after many test fits a nice snug fit was finally found....




Now it's time to drill some holes. More updates later....
 
What cable did you use to wire the head unit into the car, i am looking at putting a stereo into the car and found the fascia i need just not sure on what cable i am going to need to get it all powered up
 
Ok so a bit of an update....

As you may well know I have been thru the mill a bit of late on a personal level. Getting this install finished has been the one real positive thing to happen over the last few months. It was with a huge amount of excitement (& indeed expectation) I was looking forward to my first meet of the year, & where several friends from more distant parts of the UK would get a chance to hear the car for the first time. So there I am sitting in the car wash just along from the meet, I only had LBC on the radio during the journey, so I decide to crank it up a bit to get it nicely warmed up for the many demos I was expecting. All seemed fine initially, but as soon as the bass kicked in the sound virtually cut out from the subwoofer AND the front speakers. Honestly you couldn't make it up!!!

I visibly checked all the connections, nothing was loose, nor indeed had been actually touched since the install was completed. To say I was crestfallen just doesn't do how i was feeling justice. I was absolutely devastated. No amount of tinkering with the Head Unit could solve the issue, however the rear door speakers were still working absolutely fine. This made no sense whatsoever.

Anyway I had a pretty miserable meet, and really couldn't at that stage start to comprehend what could be the issue. The amplifier under my driver seat was working fine for the rear doors, yet my two main ones were BOTH cutting out at the same time.

On the way home I had not handsfree bluetooth, nor indeed Sat-Nav guidance as they all function thru the front speaker set up. I pulled over on my way, and was checking again for anything lose, yet forund no issues. Wothout a multimeter to test signals etc my thoughts then turned to the Pioneer Head Unit, maybe it had somehow got in a tiswas, so I did a complete Factory Reset on that hoping to fix the issue, but to no avail. All I did was completely lose all my set up benchmarks for time alignment, navigation, bluetooth and various other bits.

Once I got home, for the next 3 weeks I didn't even want to look at the car let alone drive it. I was so utterly fed up, and with finances being tight atm, I didn't even want to contemplate something that could possibly be an expensive fix. Finally I decided to grab the bull by the horns. After much pondering in the armchair, I had narrowed the issue down to the rear battery, or something connected to it. I knew nothing had been touched on the install, I also knew the car was still starting fine, so the front battery must still be ok.

3 things didn't quite add up though.
1). Both AGM Batteries were bought at the same time and are identical.
2). The Amplifier under my seat is connected to the same boot mounted Fused Distribution Block as the other two amplifiers, yet was working perfectly.
3). I install things properly, and for 2 high quality amplifiers to exhibit similar failure at the same time was more than a little coincidental, in fact the chances of it happening at exactly the same time are ridiculously remote.

So finally out comes the multimeter & a screwdriver or two to check things over step buy step.

Amplifier Terminal connection tightness? Check
Turn on signal to amps? Check
Power to amplifiers? Check
Audio Signal from the Head Unit? Check
Battery connections tight? Check
Earth? Barely at all.

WTF?????????

Both boot mounted amplifiers were connected to a huge Earth Block in the boot, then a 0AWG Earth Cable is routed alongside the Power Cable out of the boot, and passes in conduit under the car and up into the engine bay, where it terminates directly to the Battery, which in itself is connected with upgraded earths to the car body, and engine/transmission. Earthing really should never have been any kind of issue.

Putting the probe on the ring terminal showed there was a good earth. Now my heqad was beginning to ache. So I checked under the car, but the cables showed no sign of damage to the conduits containing them. The the probe was touched onto the slightly exposed part to the cable end (just under the heat shrink) yet barely had a connection. What??? I had crimped that terminal myself using a pretty big hydraulic crimping tool that would have applied a massive crimping force. This still disn't add up. So off came the heat shrink, and a check again with the meter showed barely an earth at all, so I pulled through a little spare cable, and cut off the terminal. Once again though, there was barely any earth at all in the cable. I stripped back more of the insulation and discovered the nasty truth.

As a cost saving excersize I had used 0AG CCA instead of 100% OFC Copper for the Earth Cable run from the boot to the front battery. CCA is Copper Clad Aluminium, and is somewhat cheaper than 100% pure copper. It is aluminium cable strands making up the cable, but it is dipped in copper so 90% or so is aluminium and the outside has a thin layer of copper. As most of the power is used up by the amplifiers, the return earth will have a much easier job carrying the current back to the front battery to complete the circuit. It is used by some people on their installs for the power run too, but you just need to usually go up one gauge on the cable to ensure it can handle the same power safely as 100% OFC Copper, as CCA of the same thickness is rated slightly lower.

Anyway saving some cash wouldn't have been any issue at all, exept I seem to have had a bad batch of cable, the aluminium in the cable itself seemed to have oxidised in some way and was corroded to the point of falling apart. Stipping back more of the cable showed it had corroded more than 12" along the cable length, albeit to a lesser extent the furth I stripped back. Basically the entire cable needs to go in the bin, the only problem with itis that it is not readily accessible, and is covered in conduit, so pretty much a full day or at least a few hours will be needed to strip it all out and run a new cable in it's place, along with securing the entire run back in place under the car.

The corrosion goes further than I could actually remove, so as a temporary measure, I have cut the cable back as far as I can in the engine bay, and crimped/soldered an new earth ring, but this is only a temporary fix so I have sound again, there is no option when I am feeling up to it, the run must be replaced. I am going to have to try to get a refund on the cable, as it is obviously faulty, but will more likely go for 100% OFC Copper as a replacement. Lightening should never strike in the same place twice, but tbh with the total ball ache of replacing this cable, routing in conduit etc & the time to actually do it, I'm not going to tempt fate.

At least the car is back with proper sounds again, and has improved my mood quite considerably. Those of you wondering why the amplifier under my seat which powers the rear doors was still working fine? Answer: this amplifier runs a seperate earth under my seat to the chassis.


Anyway after all that, who wants to see some pictures?
 
Just a couple I haven't posted up before.....

Here is my Alpine Freeview DVB-T TV Tuner, underneath the front passenger seat


Finished & time for the seat to go back in


This is the driver door card getting a thin layer of CCF (the black stuff) used a a decoupler to help prevent any vibration from the door itself against the door card.


Similarly on the passenger doorcard. Notice the black square at the rear.


This chunky bit of paper mache (left end) was removed from the door cards so the inner door skin could be sealed up but the inner skin covering of silent coat to provide a proper sealed enclosure for the speaker within the door itself.
 
More Silent Coat, this is on the front & rear doors, this particular picture shows the inside of the very outer door skin.



Applying the inner door skin with silent coat


The finished door panel prior to the door car being replaced. Note the crossover mounted above the speaker, and the Foam F.A.S.T Ring around the speaker itself. This provides a seal so all the speaker output goes thru the door grill and into the car, rather than some of it lost to inside the door card etc. MDF mounts are hidden uner the foam.


Explanation of the F.A.S.T Rings here and more info/pics here

Apologies for lack of pictures for the final parts of the install, but getting the car finished was the priority and time was a factor.
 
I think this is everything in my install but probably missed something out...

Pioneer F-60DAB Head Unit/Sat Nav/DVD/USB
Alpine TUE-T150DV DVB-T TV Tuner
Alpine KRE-500E Remote Eye
Alpine KAE-210DV Amplified DVB-T Tuner Aerial
Alpine RUE-4143 Remote control
AudioControl Epicentre with Remote

JL Audio 1000/1 Amplifier (Subwoofer)
JL Audio 300/4 Amplifier (Front stage)
JL Audio A-2150 Amplifier (Rear doors)
JL Audio 12W7-3 Subwoofer
JL Audio C5-650 Tweeters (Dash)
JL Audio C3-650 Component/Coaxials (Front doors)
JL Audio C2-650 Components (Rear doors)
JL Audio RBC-1 Remote Bass Controller

Pyle PLCM HONDA Infrared Rear Camera
Silent Coat 2mm & 4mm Multi Bulk packs
CCF Decoupling foam 9mm & 3mm

0awg OFC Power & Ground Cables
4awg OFC Power & Ground Cables
0agw & 4awg Gold Terminals

KnuKoncept 0AWG Battery Terminals KBT-30 & BT-104
KnuKoncept KNF-60 Fused Distribution Block
KnuKoncept KNF-36 Fused Distribution Block
KnuKoncept 8AWG x2 Subwoofer Cable
KnuKonceptz Krystal 4 Channel RCA Kables
Heat resistant Plastic Conduit trunking


Cost a fortune and some of it was second hand or re-used from my old install, but full retail prices would be utterly mental. I mean for starters the Head Unit was £1,000, the subwoofer & subwoofer amplifier would be almost £1,500, front speakers £500+, TV Tuner £210, it just goes on & on, but after the great feedback I got at Japfest at the weekend, it was worth every hour spent on the install & every single penny.
 
So hooked up with Faz (Mr CL7) last night for an audition, we had a great laugh but I will let him say what he thinks of the install. I'm still discovering new things this Pioneer head unit does. With Apple Car play I can actually vocally tell the phone who in my contact list to call & it does it. Even more impressive is when I told the Pioneer to send him a text message, I dictated the message & it sent, straight to his phone in his pocket in the passenger seat. I didn't know I could do that! It's pretty cool & a very impressive thing to do on a demo.

Then just as we had finished up with the demo & we're just chatting something incredible happened right in front of our eyes I didn't think I would see in near daylight..... Just too funny!!

Anyway I'm sure Faz will let you all know what he thought of the car ICE install. if anyone else in SE London/Kent border wants a listen just shout me up!
 
Wow! This stuff is awesome! What a write up!
 
So what happened?
 
One for the Car Audio fans who have followed my ICE install build or just had a quick demo.

Last Thursday evening I went to Huets The In-Car Specialists in Shoreham, they are a well known ICE dealer on the South Coast & massively respected for their installs. They were having an ICE Night, various cars were there from an old (but spotless) Capri & XR4i to various VW's, along with the JL Audio UK guys with their Demo Audi A3, and Huets had their own new JL Demo Car as well. There was also Kenwood UK (cough) there with a nice Demo Scirocco. Sounded pretty good, but it's four subwoofers were only just about on a par with my 1 subwoofer loooooool. I digress.

Whilst I was there chatting to the guys from JL, I was introduced to a smartly dressed American guy. He is George Jenkins and turn out works for JL Audio at their Electronics & Research faciltity in Phoenix & is the Director of International Sales. He overheard me talking to the other guys about my install & wanted to have a listen. **** yes!!!! Turns out he formerly worked at Pioneer, Bose, Boston Acoustics, and most recently Kicker.

After a quick look around my install I gave him a demo, he asked about the head unit & I showed him some of the tricks. He then asked if he could plug his iPhone in and use the Apple Car Play to play some of his playlist. Some more acoustic stuff came up from Stevie Ray Vaughan amongst others, and he was very impressed. He gets to hear a lot of different installs on his travels to shows etc, some fully pro installs, others by enthusiasts like myself, & it really makes him smile to hear a JL install that has been installed & set up properly to get the best possible sound out of it. I got a big thumbs up. To say I was pretty chuffed doesn't even come close!!

I know some might say "well he would say that wouldn't he?", but tbh after a few tracks of mine he could have made excuses and left as he was there on a professional level to talk to journos, distributors & dealers etc, but to sit there and then want to go thru several tracks off his phone as well tells me he was enjoying it 100%.

So the man from JL Audio, he said "Yes!" & that's good enough for me :D

George Jenkins from JL Audio


Huets Staff & George Jenkins from JL Audio


Huets JL Demo Golf


The Official JL Audio Demo Audi A3


Kenwood Scirocco


Spotless Ford Capri


Ford XR4i Revolution




P.S There will be a photo or two of me talking to George at some point, but I'm awaiting the journos to post them online, but as it was Modified Nationals the following day it will probably be later this week.
 
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