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Better turbo

J

joebucks

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Messages
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Location
Bucks, UK
Car
7th Gen
I'm told I'm mapped to the limit of my turbo, fair enough, but need a new turbo though ...

http://www.turbobygarrett.com/turbobygarrett/products/turbo_kits/GM_Duramax.htm how about that, name I recognize, don't know much about what I've got, might be a stupid suggestion, please forgive me if it is ... if anyone does know what I got, some model numbers perhaps ??

Anyone ?? advice/suggestions ?? phone number of a guy perhaps ??

I am aware it's not the only thing that'll need upgrading, don't fret we're not blowing anything up here, just gathering information in order to create a budget for next year to get all this done ... these turbos quote 500+ hp, I'm not daft, my realistic aim is ~250-300, and like I said I'm aware quite a lot will need upgrading in order to achieve that, but I'm right in thinking not block, box or internals right ??

Also aware it's fairly mental to do this to a frontwheel drive 1.5 tonne car, don't worry about it ...
 
I can only find civic ones on ebay ... I found one the other day that said accord, 6 paddle ... I knew I'd need one of them, top of my list ...

Is the turbo really "easy" ??
 
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/HONDA-ACCORD-2-2-PERFORMANCE-CLUTCH-KIT-/300488087235?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item45f67c56c3

found one ... 5 paddle ...

If it goes through them at a rate I can't handle, then I'll detune it till I can handle it ... though even a clutch every year would be okay ...
 
Not really looking for economy, or not as much as I'm looking for power ... think of it as a technical excersize ... just a project, the only desired outcome is power, if there's any way to make that economical, I'll be shocked, but it'd only be a bonus ...
 
I think you have one of our stage 2 remaps Joe. The remap isn't pushing the turbo to it's limits actually, far from it. But it's a combination of fuelling, turbo and the small intercooler fitted to the car that will restrict how much power it's making.

As advised before, start with the easy stuff like your intercooler and you've already done the exhaust. Your engine internals may handle upto 250bhp relatively safely but you'll be pushing the high pressure fuel pump very hard as well as hitting the ceiling of your injectors (not even sure if the those Bosch injectors are upto the task)..

Gotta agree with CJ (mostly) the biggest problem you will have is the clutch.
 
You must be confusing it CJ, our Stage 2 is based on 192/320lb ft - it's about the safest limit we like not to exceed. No evidence to suggest its damaged anyone's internals unless you know something I don't?
 
Ok good ... so then, say I get the IC & Fuel pump sorted out, can elite supply a map to take advantage of those alone, without putting extra pressure on the turbo, and I'll see where it goes on a dyno ( and a few months of durability testing ) ?? or would elite be able to supply a map that's already been dyno'd with similar mods ?? I wouldn't want to go from 192 to 250 on those mods alone, but just whatever you think is safe to extract from those ... or am I looking at having to do more before anything can be changed ??

Also, the IC's not in a very good place, so having it worked on doesn't seem the best option, what about a universal one ( I'll do my homework ) ??
 
Talk to Andy (Monks) I think he had his IC done.
 
Joe good luck with the quest for power, anything can be done given enough money and will.

Like has been said turbo isnt the issue at all, you have wasted your money on the elite map considering your overall aim. You need a modified clutch and pressure plate, new intercooler and then a bespoke rolling road map created. You will then be knocking at the door of around 220hp at which point you will be in desperate need of brake and chassis mods to ensure you can get the best fun out of what you have created.
 
I infrmed joe that the stage 2 was the safest bet for his engine, turbo and drivetrain until things get upgraded. i know the internals 'can' handle 250, but then how long they last is only a matter of guessinga which in reality isnt worth the risk.
 
TheHole said:
I infrmed joe that the stage 2 was the safest bet for his engine, turbo and drivetrain until things get upgraded. i know the internals 'can' handle 250, but then how long they last is only a matter of guessinga which in reality isnt worth the risk.
Click to expand...

I agree Adam would be interesting to see how long it would last at that power, Joe has money to burn so Im quite looking forward to see how its all goes.
 
andy, i would not call the remap a waste of money. it has shown joe that this engine is capable, and whilst getting the necassary information together to see if he goes further or not is up to him.
 
My point was simply he wants max power and that map wont do what he wants, he needed to spend the money on other things to get this power quest well on its way.

Im not knocking the elite map at all if he had the std celtic map I would have said the same things.
 
Excellent news, I could settle for 220 ... for a while at least ...

Any pointers on companies that would manufacture or supply said clutch kit and or IC ??

brakes/chassis (ride related, not actual subframes !!)/suspension are either easy to find, or can be taken from another honda with more power, even if whole legs/arms/bars have to come out and bodies widened ... whatever it takes ...
 
Andy, I understood what you meant mate, and I agree with it...

Joe to answer your question, yes of course we can bespoke tune but we will need the car for at least a day on the dyno following your hardware mods.

Listen to the advice regarding clutch and brakes - seriously.

Regarding the question of 250bhp CJ, it was me that brought it up and no I don't have any info to back it up, it's purely an educated guess based on how we know Honda over engineer their engines.. With stage 2 we are pushing the standard car to its safest achievable ceiling..

Anything over and above that will require some bespoke hardware mods.
 
Ok excellent, at least a plan has been formed .... if you can get back to me with price for day on rolling road I can add that to the list ...

Dont let the misses hear you using the words burn and money in the same sentence ... I'm persuing my interests, not burning money :D
 
It is a diesel too - much more economic :D. (senses CJ gnawing the furniture).
 
Dan Robinson said:
It is a diesel too - much more economic :D. (senses CJ gnawing the furniture).
Click to expand...

I think the days of the i-vtec are numbered, theres a new kid on the block lol :lol: :lol: :lol: :D
 
the diesel can never be better than an i vtec engine given the same effort and money to mod it,trust me,it can be just improved....but if the same amount of mods was thrown at a vtec it will produce much more power than a diesel,and agree with faddy and cj, you'll have to look after your clucth, remember competition cars use ceramic clutches that have a greatly increased friction coefficient which is not considered suitable for passenger cars(dont know if any available for the 7gen accord),so you need to ask your self if the car is going to be uesd for track purpose or everyday use...?also upgrading your brake disks and pads to performance pads,again performance pads are great for the track but not so friendly on everyday driving. all this depends on what type of car your after joe,if its a track monster your after then your better off getting a petrol as there will be a need for a torque sensitive l.s.d and close ratio gear box,which is more likely to be available for petrol than the diesel,the 7 gen diesel will always have its limits joe.
 
been reading thru all the posts on here.. all valid points... but like cj said id change to a petrol to get the most out of it if i was spending alot of money... 2,4 is nice but a k20.24 hybrid is even better... if not then a c32a/b... i want one of those sooo badly but yeh i think petrol is the best for you with the amount of money your thinking of dumping in
 
ukaccord said:
the diesel can never be better than an i vtec engine given the same effort and money to mod it,trust me,it can be just improved....but if the same amount of mods was thrown at a vtec it will produce much more power than a diesel,and agree with faddy and cj, you'll have to look after your clucth, remember competition cars use ceramic clutches that have a greatly increased friction coefficient which is not considered suitable for passenger cars(dont know if any available for the 7gen accord),so you need to ask your self if the car is going to be uesd for track purpose or everyday use...?also upgrading your brake disks and pads to performance pads,again performance pads are great for the track but not so friendly on everyday driving. all this depends on what type of car your after joe,if its a track monster your after then your better off getting a petrol as there will be a need for a torque sensitive l.s.d and close ratio gear box,which is more likely to be available for petrol than the diesel,the 7 gen diesel will always have its limits joe.
Click to expand...


there are tons of aftermarket racing products available for the cl7 ( euroR mind you ) from ceramic brakes ( project mu and endless ) to ceramic triple plate clutches both from exedy and spoon and even amuse ) too many to dela with but trust me when is ay the cl7 is coverd in evry angle the same way as how much after market parts are available for the dc2 and ek9
 
Thanks for all the tips chaps, but some of you are totally missing the point ... the whole idea is a modified diesel ... more power is available from a petrol version of the same car, but it wouldn't run on diesel and would be ten to the dozen .... something different, something different that runs on diesel is the idea ... if the plan were to have the fastest honda accord I could have, clearly I'd have bought a petrol one, that was never the plan ... I don't want a petrol one, no matter how much can be extracted from it, or how much easier it is to modify ...
 
Weeeeell, I didn't say I wanted fuel economy, I said I'd be surprised if fuel economy could be achieved once modified ...

I think I am being realistic, ~250bhp from a modified engine that can develop ~192 bhp on standard internals is quite realistic and have already said I'm willing to have parts manufactured/changed where they don't exist in order to achieve that goal ... all I'm really interested in is approaching, and hopefully safely reaching thsose limits, not breaking them, not getting a petrol version, and not fuel economy ...
 
^^ good luck.........

not sure what companies would say to make pistons etc just for u to date there are no aftermarket parts available for the accord diesel ie pistons rods etc... so even tho you want more power form the diesel i dont think it can be achieved with no parts available... sure u can get turbos and intercoolers etc but engine internals is another story and for increased power means forging interior is nessesary .....

if you do manage to get a company to do just a set for you then ur all good... but i doubt it would be reliable....
 
Well depending on who you ask, more power is available on stock internals, so not much need to look for such engineering companies as yet ... I'm obviously hoping by the way that I won't need to have anything engineered ... I didn't know there was such a lack of parts ...

It'd odd because more than one mapping company have said that in order to get more power I need an uprated clutch, well ... how do they know that if there are no uprated clutches :s
 
Look luck with this Joe i think you have money to burn :) but it will be good reading on how it goes.
220-250 BHP you will be given the Audi a run for its money :D
 
aren't diesel internals forged and all that anyway. they are very robust.
Issue is IC- fuel pump- injectors- and clutch?
 
^^ summed up what I've been trying to say very well.

With regards to uprated clutches, Elite were telling me one of their clients had one made up for his Civic ICTDI. I'll try and find out who it was next time I speak to them.
 
There was a big thread over on civicinfo or somewhere About uprating the pressure plate and using kevlar friction material. I think johnk posted it up.
very informative
 
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