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Diesel Bug

marctwoo

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Very unusual one: car has been throwing P0087 since I've had her (month and a bit), fuel filter (genuine) replaced, no change. Took it to a local diesel specialist, he can’t find a code nor replicate the issue (pansy driver I imagine). Anyway we were discussing potential causes the day after when I'd managed to throw the EML again and I told him I’d done the fuel filter recently, he asked was there much gunk. So I showed him the pics:

1.jpg

2.jpg

3.jpg

And he goes it looks like you've got the "Diesel Bug".

I came home and did my homework: common in the marine diesel engine world, very little info for automotive.

Question is has anyone else ever come across this?

Reading between the lines of the history of the car, it does look like it has been stood for a while (common enabler for the bug to manifest).

I've ordered a diesel bug test kit from a marine stockist to confirm but going off the pics, the P0087 and the hesitation under load, it does make sense.

Not looking forward to the potential remedy, cleaning out the whole fuel tank, lines, etc...
 

F6HAD

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Never heard of it to be honest but it does make sense that you’ve got a restriction in the fuel supply..

can you not run on it through on v power diesel and some extra additives for a few tankfuls and then maybe another fuel filter change and see if it clears up?
 

Channel Hopper

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It is probably a microbial fungus from the biodiesel fraction in the pump fuel and will be the consistency of primordial soup in the tank well, pipes and the hand pump.


Only a complete flush of the system will guarantee a clear filter next time.
 

edgeoftime

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I have a boat powered by Ford SABRE 180HP engines, in the past we did have the dreaded bug, the solution was to drain the tanks, then refill with fresh fuel and some snake oil treatment, new fuel filters and crossed fingers. Since then no problems. Very surprised to hear of it occurring in road vehicles though, due to the fact that we get through a lot of fuel and regular fill ups. I can only suggest that your car has been standing for a long time at some point, if this is so and proposed for the future then brim the tank, as if air space is left condensation will form and the the blighters will reemerge.
 

marctwoo

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Thank you all for the replies.

From what I understand, killing the bug off isn't the problem with many automotive and marine products available, issue is getting rid of all the gunk and crap left behind that will continue to cause a restriction and potentially make it easier for the bug to return. I've been reading through a few of the products and there is no "flush", as in there is no product that is able to dissolve all the crud and flush it through the system. And then when you add the word "flush" to your search, every snake oil product under the sun rears its head. A bit of a minefield to say the least.

Also all these cleaning services are either "polishing" whereby they clean the fuel you already have only (not really fussed as cars are being refilled every week) with no mention of tank/system clean or its the other end of spectrum where commercial cleaning is available for tanks the size of houses.

So plan of action is:

1. Verify diesel bug with test kit
2. Run a biocide through the system and continue to do so for the short to medium term (treatments don't seem that expesive with dilution rates small)
3. Try to figure out how to physically/manually clean out the fuel tank and all the hoses!!!
 

Channel Hopper

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Why not syphon out some fuel from the lowest point of the tank ?

If cloudy or opaque you know you have a cleaning job this weekend. The filter is a big clue.
 

Adamkara2525

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Hello just reading your post I have a similar issue on mine . P0087 fuel pressure low. I suspect it's the fuel pump however most of the time my car is running fine and just occasionally it will throw up an engine management light whilst driving and my accelerator will stop working until I switch off the engine and restart then my car runs fine again. Could be fine for weeks sometimes even months until the error returns.

Did u manage to drop the diesel tank out or resolve the problem ?
 

marctwoo

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Why not syphon out some fuel from the lowest point of the tank ?

If cloudy or opaque you know you have a cleaning job this weekend. The filter is a big clue.
Thats the plan when I get the time/its not pouring down outside!!

Hello just reading your post I have a similar issue on mine . P0087 fuel pressure low. I suspect it's the fuel pump however most of the time my car is running fine and just occasionally it will throw up an engine management light whilst driving and my accelerator will stop working until I switch off the engine and restart then my car runs fine again. Could be fine for weeks sometimes even months until the error returns.

Did u manage to drop the diesel tank out or resolve the problem ?
As mentioned, above when I get a chance, I'll keep you posted.

I see you're from Coventry, the garage I mentioned earlier in the thread was Diesel Engine Services/Swallow Garage, don't know if you want to go have a chat with them? I was planning on going back at some point if I couldn't remedy the problem, he said he was awaiting a firmware update on their main diagnostic kit so that might be able to show an issue. Nice chap.

But your issue sounds identical to mine, as mentioned many times on the forum, have you changed the fuel filter?
 

Channel Hopper

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Whilst I cannot check the Tourer (as the back seat is down and there is a lot of stuff on top), other cars I have owned have the fuel level system accessible from the inside (Citroens/Lancias etc.)
 

marctwoo

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Hi guys a quick update.

Finally got around to checking the tank, as Channel Hopper mentioned, straightforward access via rear seats. Just been ultra busy of late that’s why it took so long.

Good news: tank is clean, fuel looks relatively clear as you can see some sedimentation at the bottom but I used the test kit just to be sure, just waiting for cultures to grow if there is anything.

So the bad news is the problem still persists and I don't have a cause.

Now I've been driven the car for the bit, the hestitaion seems to rear its head in 2 distinct cases: sustained 20-40% throttle at any revs (disappears after giving it more throttle) or 100% throttle at 3k plus.

I'll let you all know what the test kit results are...
 

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Hi there,
As inherited a nice low mileage accord which throwing P0087 suspect same diesel bug. Before starting big tests etc have you had any solid resolution to it?
Many thanks
 

Channel Hopper

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Get the seats up and siphon out as much old fuel as you can. Run a rag on a stick to clean the tank sides and leave to dry.

Then change the fuel filter.
 

marctwoo

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Hi there,
As inherited a nice low mileage accord which throwing P0087 suspect same diesel bug. Before starting big tests etc have you had any solid resolution to it?
Many thanks
Recommend changing the fuel filter first to rule that out, from all my research on the forum and beyond this is normally the root cause of P0087.

I eventually got to my root cause: faulty injector. Took it to diesel specialist in Sandwell, Birmingham who advised injector removal and inspection/testing and injector 3 was suffering from blow by, failed test and looked pretty knackered. Brand new injector and £350 later working a treat now although the violent shaking/hesitation caused something to start a humming/grinding noise akin to wheel bearing noise (same symptoms as well) during that time. Something else to diagnose, joys of motoring…
 

Sysek

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Recommend changing the fuel filter first to rule that out, from all my research on the forum and beyond this is normally the root cause of P0087.

I eventually got to my root cause: faulty injector. Took it to diesel specialist in Sandwell, Birmingham who advised injector removal and inspection/testing and injector 3 was suffering from blow by, failed test and looked pretty knackered. Brand new injector and £350 later working a treat now although the violent shaking/hesitation caused something to start a humming/grinding noise akin to wheel bearing noise (same symptoms as well) during that time. Something else to diagnose, joys of motoring…
Hi Marctwoo,
1. Thanks for suggestion, plan is to Ill start this weekend with fuel filter and tank check/siphon out to check fuel quality .

2. As Im getting loads of white smoke (no coolant in oil) as smell of unburned fuel combined with really hard to start - I was wondering about injectors passing too much fuel in and causing low pressure by being failed-open is thats possible? Can I check them with multimeter for resistance (whats the ohm setpoints if so)?
I'd like to pull them out and clean as some you tube videos show but wonder if checking on situ (unplug harness and check resistance whilst its in the block) also 9V battery link to hear the click?.

3. Also seen some info about pressure relieve valve(PRV) stuck open would this be causing fuel rail low pressure?

attached my codes plus DPF is on as well which at <£40k would it be a blinded probes by the white smoke only?

many thanks
 

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F6HAD

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Your dpf is still in the car? It’s not remapped or modified in any way? Based on what you’re saying there’s a strong chance your fault is killing your dpf anyway.

With these errors and those symptoms you’ve got some fairly major fuelling issues, I would suspect a few things at fault including bad injectors and possibly a failing high pressure pump.
 

csak1981

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Could the P1065 code be pointing towards the codes for the injectors have been lost?
Maybe they just need re-coded back in
 

Sysek

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DPF is still in the car as far as I can tell. Looks untouched to me.

I think I need to invest in better dongle would recommend something like Autel Ap200 do you know if its any good? will it be able to help with injectors recoded or DPF diagnostics? Adaptation etc?

I cant get any more than 1065 for injectors info on my simple obd reader.

Ive worked with VCDS on my old passat but new to honda on diagnostic tools.
 

F6HAD

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Losing injector codes won’t cause any of these issues mate.

You actually need to remove the injectors and have them tested. Also check your fuel pressure at the rail. A decent diag will be able to do that.
 

Sysek

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Had very little spare time this weekend, but:
1. I think, correct me if Im wrong, that I can rule out diesel bug in my case. Took the rear seat out to get to low pressure fuel pump, I’d opened the pulled it out , no sings of any mould nor cloudiness to the diesel (unfortunately I couldn't upload photos as kept saying too large file however reduced to 200kb?) , took sample in glass jar to make it more transparent nad visible-again nice and clear).
2. As pump was out tried simply test it with my 9V battery and pump gave sound out but nothing got pupmped out, nor feel of any suction or pressure on either suction or delivery in/out pipes. Is this beasure I used the 9V and should be 12V or more than that?
Tried to add video of this operation but cant. How can you do it?

3. Did simple check on injectors by unplugging each from harness and connecting to 9v battery via crocodile clips and tested for click sound. All 4 injector gave same nice clicking sound.

4. next step is to get filter which started as per nice writeupby CJM Dr Diesel ;) on another thread on this forum.
 
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