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Electrical gremlin

D

delbert

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Messages
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Location
Bristol
Car
Accord i-CTDi
I've recently been experiencing a rather weird problem with my CTDi. When I first get in the car all is well, the car starts, drives and is otherwise a perfect Honda. However when I stop for a few minutes and then go to re-start the car the green key light on the dash flashes continuously, the coil light fails to show and the car refuses to start (but will turn over). If I now lock the car and unlock sometimes it will then start, occasionally though (and it seem to be happening more regularly) the car has to be left for around 30 minutes before it will start again.

I've tried leaving the battery disconnected for 24 hours and all seemed ok for a few days but it's back now and it's starting to get frustrating.

I'm wondering if some kind of fault code may be recorded (and if so is it the sort of thing I could buy some kit to read?) or has anyone else suffered this problem?
 
its an immobiliser problem. I'm not sure on the accord but on Alfa 156s there is a antenna cable coiled on the ignition barrel that gets disconnected which causes the exact symptoms you have until eventually the car won't start. I would remove the plastic around the ignition and take a look. failing that take the car to an auto electrician and get it mended before it leaves you by the side of the road.

the problem is your car is struggling to read the immobiliser chip in your key when you put it in the ignition.
try your spare key and see how that goes. if its the same then it will be the antenna.
 
is your key damaged in anyway?
 
I think the ignition barrel idea is an interesting one, I'll have a look.

I've tried both keys, it's the same with both.

It still seem strange that giving the car some time fixes the issue though.
 
do you have any key rings or anything of that sort on there that could cause interference, just checking the troubleshooting it gives in the manual for the car, thats what it mentions.
 
Only seen this once before and I can't remember the fix exactly but it was an ECU change in the end...
 
ECU replacement?! I can see my bank balance trembling at the thought!

We have two diesel Accords in the family so is there anything I could temporarily switch from the other car to test this? I'm guessing that's probably a silly question as I expect you need all sorts of programming tools etc to do an ECU switch (and on that basis I suppose it's not worth looking for a second hand one?)
 
Was one chap that ended up needing a new ecu?

You can exchange ecu as far as I know, obviously batt disconnected and all that. The keys will be programmed to the ecu on the other accord, so your keys wont work. If you hold the keys from the other car near the barrel then it prob will start that way.

handy you got another accord :)
 
Del, sorry didn't want to frighten you. I just remember another member ages ago having a similar problem and Honda tried changing all sorts of immobiliser related components and in the end replaced the ECU (and I think that fixed it) or he may have sold the car on... and you may have bought it even?

To say this problems is rare is an understatement.

As for ECU swapping. You can swap ECU's but as Sal says the immobiliser keys are coded into your ECU, and also the software revisions on your ECU that control the engine maps are likely to be different (unless you get lucky) so not advisable to drive the car (if it starts).
 
First thing i would do is take the car to Honda and ask them to reset the Immobiliser, If that does not work get them to test the signal strength of the antenna, i believe this can be done on diagnostics.

If all else fails and it is a new ECU. Touch wood its not, You could try sourcing a JDM ECU as these don't have immobilisers fitted. It would mean your driving round in a car without an immobiliser but its better than having it stuck on your drive.

Try a Google search of Honda immobiliser problem and you will see that your far from the only person with issues. Ignore any posts for cars pre 2003 because Honda used a hamilton and palmer alarm, after 03 they used there own.
 
Or try The Ecu Doctor who can remove the immobiliser. Used him before and excellent service. If you google him he's based in Plymouth area.
 
F6HAD said:
Del, sorry didn't want to frighten you. I just remember another member ages ago having a similar problem and Honda tried changing all sorts of immobiliser related components and in the end replaced the ECU (and I think that fixed it) or he may have sold the car on... and you may have bought it even?

To say this problems is rare is an understatement.

As for ECU swapping. You can swap ECU's but as Sal says the immobiliser keys are coded into your ECU, and also the software revisions on your ECU that control the engine maps are likely to be different (unless you get lucky) so not advisable to drive the car (if it starts).
Click to expand...

was that not someone who'd locked their key in. Then AA man came out and sent 12v down a wrong wire and ended up goosing the ECU.
May well be getting my threads mixed up....
 
Pepster said:
Diesel ECU are made by the crap German vendor & no diesel Honda have been sold in Japan.

Honda Japan is completely petrol.
Click to expand...
Does it begin with B by any chance ;)
 
I think I've now explored every possible option on this, my last steps were to get a Honda technician to run some diagnostics (which just showed that there's an immobiliser problem (no sh...!)) and I've tried an alternative induction loop (the loop around the key) but with no luck. I'm starting to see why CJ hates Bosch so much, even the tech at Honda agreed that it's the diesel's downfall!)

So Fahad, you were right, it looks like I need a new ECU. I've started to contact a few breakers (I'm hoping someone will have one as they don't go wrong that often) but it's not clear from the various numbers on the ECU as to which ones are important, I wonder if someone can help? The numbers on mine are as follows:

Custom-Er's No: 37825-RBD-E160
RBAJ Parts No: 407918-0840

As well as these two there's another 5 digit number but I think that's the serial number.

Is it just the first part of the RBAJ number or all of this that's important?

Many thanks.
 
delbert said:
I think I've now explored every possible option on this, my last steps were to get a Honda technician to run some diagnostics (which just showed that there's an immobiliser problem (no sh...!)) and I've tried an alternative induction loop (the loop around the key) but with no luck. I'm starting to see why CJ hates Bosch so much, even the tech at Honda agreed that it's the diesel's downfall!)

So Fahad, you were right, it looks like I need a new ECU. I've started to contact a few breakers (I'm hoping someone will have one as they don't go wrong that often) but it's not clear from the various numbers on the ECU as to which ones are important, I wonder if someone can help? The numbers on mine are as follows:

Custom-Er's No: 37825-RBD-E160
RBAJ Parts No: 407918-0840

As well as these two there's another 5 digit number but I think that's the serial number.

Is it just the first part of the RBAJ number or all of this that's important?

Many thanks.
Click to expand...

Try ecudoctor in Plymouth. He can remove the immobiliser for you which may solve the problem...
 
Sorry to hear this Del i hope you find a good deal on one and it dosent cost the earth.
 
Sorry to hear that mate. Please make sure you get the keys with any ecu you buy as the code will be different on the ecu to the one in the transponder chip in your keys.
You can easily remove the chip from the donar keys and put it in your original keys saving you the hassle of changing the locks and ignition barrel.


This is where to find it circled in the picture.
carkdisa.jpg



And it looks like this.
2010092113385921.jpg



Good luck pall. You should get an ecu and key set from someone breaking there car on Ebay. Chances are they wont know how much the ecu costs and you will pick up an ecu and a set of keys from between 50 and 150 quid. I got the lot for an old Alfa 156 i had for £50 on Ebay. £2200 from the dealer
 
to addto crespo... becareful prising out the chip... you don't want to break it...
 
You won't need the key, just the transponder from it. It'll keep costs down as the breaker won't give the keys without the barrel which you don't need.
 
Many thanks everyone for the advice. I will certainly give the ECU doctor a call. In the mean time does anyone have any input on the part number problem? It seems that all the ECUs I've been offered differ in the last part of both the numbers I quoted in my earlier post, I'm starting to guess that this won't matter but I'd like some confirmation.

Cheers, Del
 
Thought I'd give a final update on this just in case anyone else suffers a similar problem.

I spoke to a number of ECU repairers but none were able to deal with the Bosch unit fitted to the diesel Accords. Eventually I purchased a new ECU direct from Honda (ouch!) after a failed attempt using one from a breakers.

The one I tried from a breakers turned out to be from a facelift car, it ran my car but was constantly flashing a warning (the glow light). The fault code it was recording was 'fuel pump temperature sensor current high', this must be due to one of the differences in a facelift car.

If anyone wants a facelift ECU then I've got one you're welcome to for the £85 I paid for it.

At least I'm back on the road now, if slightly less confident with Honda's reliability. (warning: if anyone says I should have bought a petrol I'll scream!)

Del
 
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