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2.2 CTDI Laboured/Juddering on start up - What's going wrong?

Tyler Durden

Tyler Durden

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FRV
Okay, here goes.

I own a 2.2l CDTI Honda FRV, it has 55k on the clock and has F6HAD's stage one, with EGR remap on it.

Here is a video of the fault I currently have

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VwUHL1qNgM&feature=share&list=UUeqIv0_YSX9jdVoBio9I6hg


A week ago on Monday I was caught out by a tidal road while on holiday in Devon, which saw me having to drive through about 150m of foot deep sea water. When we made it to the dry road the car juddered a little in first gear, but after a short time the car drove fine and we got home with no issues.

On the Tuesday the car started and ran absolutely fine with no symptoms.

On the Wednesday the car struggled to start. In the morning it seemed to labour, judder or misfire when starting up. Once started it ran just fine and we went out for the day. When we came to start it at around 5pm that same day it took several attempts and maybe 20 seconds to get started, with the same labouring, juddering or misfiring. Again, once it had started, it appeared to run just fine.

Since then the car has continued to run fine, however the start up is not what it once was, still seeming to labour/judder/misfire before starting. It may be my imagination, but the engine also seems to stop a little rougher than before.

I am concerned about myself or my wife getting stranded.

In an attempt to see what I could figure out I have done the following.

1.Looked at the air filter which shows no sign of water ingress.
2.Had the battery checked by Kwik Fit and that was found to be fine.
3.Started and stopped the engine a few dozen times. Whilst doing this the engine, on the odd few occasions, seemed to start and stop completely normally only for the fault to return soon after. Currently I cannot get the car to start normally no matter how many times I try.


Does anyone have any idea what my issue is?

Thanks in advance for any help.
 
I have no idea but my wild guess would be a fuelling problem. I would be inclined to change the fuel filter to start with. Has it had a tankful or more of fresh diesel since the incident?
 
HuskyMan said:
I have no idea but my wild guess would be a fuelling problem. I would be inclined to change the fuel filter to start with. Has it had a tankful or more of fresh diesel since the incident?
Click to expand...

Thanks for the input, I'll consider the fuel filter, but I have used approx a tank and a half since the incident.
 
I've been having another look and tried the start up test as in my first video on a warm engine. It certainly seems easier to start, and occasionally feels normal again. See what you think, the difference is quite significant.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbPrr2LBwfM&feature=c4-overview&list=UUeqIv0_YSX9jdVoBio9I6hg
 
Check your priming bulb is hard as this sounds like air in the fule system.
Or you need a genuin new FF.
When was the last one changed and was it a genuin one
 
I have done another video after taking the car out for a "spirited" drive to get the engine hot. It seems to rule out the chance that this issue gets better when the engine has been run!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=by2yxgGCDA4&feature=c4-overview&list=UUeqIv0_YSX9jdVoBio9I6hg
 
brett said:
Check your priming bulb is hard as this sounds like air in the fule system.
Or you need a genuin new FF.
When was the last one changed and was it a genuin one
Click to expand...

+1 Give the bulb a squeeze. Or undo the drain on the bottom of the filter, see what runs out. Close and then squeeze the bulb, the book says 40/50 times after a filter change. Surprised you have no eml on though
 
Tyler Durden said:
I have done another video after taking the car out for a "spirited" drive to get the engine hot. It seems to rule out the chance that this issue gets better when the engine has been run!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=by2yxgGCDA4&feature=c4-overview&list=UUeqIv0_YSX9jdVoBio9I6hg
Click to expand...

is that you stopping it or is it just refusing to run?
 
brett said:
Check your priming bulb is hard as this sounds like air in the fule system.
Or you need a genuin new FF.
When was the last one changed and was it a genuin one
Click to expand...

The priming bulb feels harder than I thought it would, but then I've never squeezed it before so I couldn't say for sure.

The history of the car states that the fuel filter was last changed in 2010 about 15000 miles ago, but I can't say whether a genuine part was used. The work was performed by Atlas Garage in Birmingham, so not a Honda Centre.
 
I'd definitely get the fuel filter replaced with a Honda one anyway.

When was the battery last replaced?
 
It does sound like air in the filter, I would put a new genuine filter in first & then start the trial & error or get it on a code reader - could also be blocked EGR
 
You are displaying similar symptoms to my accord my 2.2 ctdi also struggles to start when the engine is warm/hot.

I have previously changed the FF and checked the battery but the problem still remains, still no answer unfortunately!

It starts first time when cold or even freezing, the only thing i can think of is maybe a sensor that is faulty, which one who knows?
 
several have pointed out fuelling and always steer towards filter. It could be low fuel pressure due to an injector leaking off or a worn pump. They can be fine when cold but when everything has warmed up then restarting probs can occur.
 
The filter has been changed, but the issue remains. At the moment I'm living with it as it never fails to start.

The issue certainly seems worse when the engine is hot.
 
Was it a genuine Honda part? The Accord does always need genuine OEM fuel filters, they really respond badly to non OEM fuel filters for some reason.
 
Tyler Durden said:
This problem is still bothering me. Does anyone have any other thoughts about what to try next?

Thanks
Click to expand...

Hi,

I found a workaround, I read it somewhere and at first I didn't believe it but it seems to be working so far.

All I am doing is turning the ignition on waiting for all the lights to do their bits, starting the engine and pressing the clutch in if the start becomes laboured.

Hey presto!
 
That would suggest there is some load or imbalance in the engine that is preventing it from starting somehow.. maybe even a crank or cam sensor which isn't getting it's signal from the pickup.

Is your flywheel ok? do you notice any rumble on idle?
 
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