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Tourer rear Brake change

Dan Robinson

Grand High Plumber
Messages
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Location
Henlow, Beds
Car
06 EX Tourer i-CTDI
Ok. Full write up of changing the discs and pads of the Tourer. I just used Honda stock pads and discs as it seemed a little daft upgrading the rears which really do little real braking.

First off – get the car on stands and remove the wheels.
Next – Callipers. Remove the two nuts at the back of the calliper (A & B ) and the bracket that holds the brake line closest to the wheel ( C ). You might need WD40 to get the bracket bolts undone. Do not force them too much without putting a spanner on the lock nuts at the back and balancing your forces.

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It is worth doing the other side at the same time as you will need the bolts that hold that bracket of for removing the disc.
Tie off the callipers so that the brake line is not kinked or stressed. Make sure that it is secure whilst you are working.
Next Undo the two 3 point Philips screws that hold the disc to the hub. They might be finger nail tight (like mine) or you might need an impact driver to get them loose.

SANY0004%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG


Now, the first challenge. Many thanks to Rob for talking me through this bit as it had me a little flustered.
Get the disc off. Make sure you have the handbrake off. Remove the little rubber bung. Rotate the hub so that the hole for this bung is at 7 O’clock for the nearside, and 4 O’clock for the offside:

SANY0004%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG


Using the bolts from the brake line brackets. Screw them in the little threaded holes on the disc.
Now carefully and alternating frequently, screw them clockwise to push the disc off the hub:

SANY0005%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG


If the disc does not free up easily by the time the bolts are all the way in, then you need to free of the parking brake shoes. This requires a little torch and a flat bladed screwdriver.

Look through the hole that was bunged. You should see a little cog, side on:
SANY0007%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG

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This is what it looks like when the disc is off:

SANY0010%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG


Poke the screwdriver through the hole and rotate the cog a little – using the blade of the screwdriver from top to bottom. Or have the handle point down and lever it up to turn the cog. This will release the shoe a little.
Repeat the initial disc removing process. If the disc still won’t come free then turn the cog a little more.
This is what you should be faced with:

SANY0016%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG


I am not sure how much material should be on the parking shoes, so if anyone thinks mine are too worn let me know. I think mine were actually rubbing a little:

SANY0013%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG

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Using brake cleaner, give the new discs a good clean and check for any damage:

SANY0011%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG


Now reassemble in reverse order. Rotate the newly fitted disc and listen for rubbing. Adjust your little cog so that it just stops this rubbing noise. Note you will probably need to adjust your handbrake afterwards.

Now for the callipers and pads. I did not bother to clean or renovate the callipers. Frankly after the hassle I had working out how to get the first disc off I didn’t have time or inclination. Beer O’clock was rapidly approaching.

Carefully ping the old pads out of the calliper. Be careful not to damage any rubber boot of the piston end. I gave mine a quick blast with the air compressor to get rid of dust and rust. As you can see my pads were VERY worn:

SANY0021%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG
 
Undo the lid of your brake fluid reservoir and leave it on top (to keep dirt out).

Now using a G-clamp. Slowly push the piston back into the calliper. Periodically check that the reservoir hasn’t over flowed. If it has, clean the spill up quickly – brake fluid is nasty stuff!

When I did the fronts I managed to push the pistons in by hand. But it wasn’t easy and you stand no change on the rears as there isn’t enough purchase and the pressure required to overcome the resistance of all that extra brake system would be too much.

SANY0017%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG


There are backing shims to be placed onto the back of the pads. And two other mystery pieces of metal the same shape. Now I didn’t fit mine, and all I can think of is that they are those doh dahs that squeal when the pads are worn.

SANY0019%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG


Once it is fully retracted; put a little dab of copper grease on the back of the pads that go against the piston. This will help removal next time. Get the right pad also. They have a little retaining spring so compare the old and new.

SANY0022%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG


Replace the callipers and bolt up. Use a torque wrench set to 55Nm to secure the calliper to the hub ***embly.

Now, seeing as I had gone through all this and I had the car up on four axel stands. I decided to bleed the brakes through. So off came the front wheels. I had 5 litres of DOT 4 from my recent clutch bleeding exercise and a brand new Vizibleed tube.

Using the following sequence I bled the entire brake lines, using around 300ml of fluid for each of the fronts. And just under 500ml for the rears. This may be too much, or I could have done more? One of the more technical chaps will no doubt confirm. Make sure you do not let the reservoir run dry!

Old man’s pee was the first thing that came to mind:

SANY0029%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG



Still all installed. Wheels tightened to 108Nm and a little cautious test drive to make sure nothing fell off. Happy days!

SANY0026%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG

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Fantastic job Dan and brilliant write-up.

Rep point on its way.
 
Brilliant!
I'll be book marking this one!
 
Typical timing, did mine last week!, however I also did the OSR flexible hose and stripped the calliper and fitted replacement seals.

Its not at all difficult and the worst bit was getting the disc/hub off the parking brake shoes (beware of the small hold down pins for each shoe, if they detach getting the disc/hub off is a *****!

My pistons were a little pitted but as I hadn't bought new ones had to be cleaned, polished and refitted (the pistons had seized making the OSR pads bind so much they nearly caught fire!)
After reading on here about the hose deteriorating from the inside as being one possible cause I did the hose at the same time.

New Pistons are about £20 (non Honda) and are worth getting if you have a seized rear brake as I would imagine most are a little pitted....

getting the bolt out of the flexi hose bracket almost sheared off the captive nut!

Bled the brakes the old fashion way with some hose, a milk bottle (containing some fluid) and a helper on the pedal (remember my father showing me and me being the helper over 30 years ago!)

All working well now. Pads and Hub/Disc from Brakes4u with the club 20% discount code cost me £67.25 inc VAT with free shipping (standard EBC discs/hubs and EBC Ultimax pads)

http://www.brakes4u.co.uk/itemdetail.asp?catid=15199
http://www.brakes4u.co.uk/itemdetail.asp?catid=10934

These are for a 2005 Tourer Ctdi

Be carefull if you change the flexi hose and the brake pipe connector is soft as putty!

HTH


Steve

PS Hub would never have cone off without the two bolt trick!
 
Commented on by the OP, all mine were correctly torqued inc the hub nuts....

Steve
 
Nice one Danny boy B)
 
Thanks all.

Jack, I did mention Torque settings - 55 for the callipers and 108 for the wheels (they're even in bold). Welcome to TA BTW....
 
Just noticed I left out the brake bleed sequence:

Bleed%252520sequence.jpg


The Vizibleed tube was perfect for the job - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/brake-bleeding-kit-one-man-brake-bleeder-clutch-bleed-/150669672526?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item23149cc04e
 
Rep point sent Dan.
Top writeup mate, how does the brakes feel now? Really starting to like your caliper colour. Does look quite good actually. Was a little skeptical at first
 
Cheers fellas- it really is quite easy. As soon as I spoke to Rob everything clicked into place and the process was simple - first wheel took two & half hours.... Second 30 minutes :lol:

Took longer to clean up afterwards.

I can tell next pad change will need an overhaul of the calipers. They are free moving, but one side if stiffer than the other.

Dunno how much dealers/garages charge for brake swaps nowadays....
 
Dan, if you managed the disc/hub swop refurbing the calliper would be a breeze.

BigRed do pistons and a seal kit for a rezsonable price or complete refurbished callipers for £180 pair

Steve
 
Cheers all... now I have some major handbrake adjustment to do.

Parked on my bruv's very steep drive yesterday and nearly took my eye out.

Any views in the amount of lining on my parking shoes?
 
Cheers all... now I have some major handbrake adjustment to do.

Parked on my bruv's very steep drive yesterday and nearly took my eye out.

Any views in the amount of lining on my parking sh

I normally go with what feels good mate, 3 clicks usually but make sure that the shoes disengage when you release the hand brake as they can quickly heat the disc up if there on even slightly.
Did you change the shoes aswell?
 
No mate, didn't think they would need doing, now I'm not so sure.
 
Same here, did the adjuster on the drum and diddn't need to do the one under the centre console, back the wheel off so they dont scrape when the handbrake is off....all through the little adjuster window!
 
nice work Dan and a good write up.
 
Dan, I had my shoes changed last year when the handbrake cable broke. The new shoes have very thin linings on them. When I say thin, I mean compared to new pads or cars that have drum brakes. I think there thin because they're expected to do little work.
 
My rear brake is still intermittently getting hot.

Having quickly had the caliper off a few weeks ago ( here ) my best guess is the piston is tight.

I haven't the time (& confidence) to overhaul the calipers myself, and plan to obtain a set of refurbished (pressure tested, leak free!) calipers and flexi hoses to try and eliminate as many possibilities as I can in one go. The driver's side appears to work fine, but I plan to do both sides whilst the tools are out.

This is new territory for me, so I've a couple of questions…

I see the carrier-to-hub bolts should be 55Nm, but what about the caliper-to-slider pin bolts?

What's the best thing to lube the sliders with when reassembling. Something long lasting, that won't perish the dust cover I'm guessing?

Is there anything else I should be aware of?

Ta, Matt.

Postscript: Aside from being scrupulously clean and careful, is it actually that hard to fit my own seal kit? Even with new pistons it would halve my outlay...
 
Thanks Dan

finally managed to tackle this myself at the weekend and it was a breeze-

however, was in such a rush that I forgot to bleed the brakes and now my pedal is having to be pushed all the way down! doh!

scott

Undo the lid of your brake fluid reservoir and leave it on top (to keep dirt out).

Now using a G-clamp. Slowly push the piston back into the calliper. Periodically check that the reservoir hasn’t over flowed. If it has, clean the spill up quickly – brake fluid is nasty stuff!

When I did the fronts I managed to push the pistons in by hand. But it wasn’t easy and you stand no change on the rears as there isn’t enough purchase and the pressure required to overcome the resistance of all that extra brake system would be too much.

SANY0017%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG


There are backing shims to be placed onto the back of the pads. And two other mystery pieces of metal the same shape. Now I didn’t fit mine, and all I can think of is that they are those doh dahs that squeal when the pads are worn.

SANY0019%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG


Once it is fully retracted; put a little dab of copper grease on the back of the pads that go against the piston. This will help removal next time. Get the right pad also. They have a little retaining spring so compare the old and new.

SANY0022%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG


Replace the callipers and bolt up. Use a torque wrench set to 55Nm to secure the calliper to the hub ***embly.

Now, seeing as I had gone through all this and I had the car up on four axel stands. I decided to bleed the brakes through. So off came the front wheels. I had 5 litres of DOT 4 from my recent clutch bleeding exercise and a brand new Vizibleed tube.

Using the following sequence I bled the entire brake lines, using around 300ml of fluid for each of the fronts. And just under 500ml for the rears. This may be too much, or I could have done more? One of the more technical chaps will no doubt confirm. Make sure you do not let the reservoir run dry!

Old man’s pee was the first thing that came to mind:

SANY0029%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG



Still all installed. Wheels tightened to 108Nm and a little cautious test drive to make sure nothing fell off. Happy days!

SANY0026%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG

SANY0024%252520%252528Medium%252529.JPG
 
Awesome write up Dan and certainly helped me. The only difficulty I had was location that cog to slacken off the shoes. It was a very bright day and despite using 3 different torches it was almost impossible to see. For anyone doing this and trying to find the cog, the picture that Dan took is with the disc off, with the disc on it's harder to see.
 
yeah, it is a pig, my 6th 7th photo was to try and give an idea of what it looks like even with or wirhout the disc.

got my fronts to do soon by the looks of it. :(
 
Bigg Red have dropped the price of a pair of callipers to £99 (after a £36 rebate on returning the old ones) plus shipping....
 
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