Menu
What's new
By:
Advanced search...

Accord PETROL Remap

alnug

alnug

Administrator
Staff member
Messages
1,020
Reaction score
20
Location
W. Yorkshire
Car
Jaguar XF S
ok Guys sorry to have kept you waiting. Seems lately Diesel guys have been getting all the fun :) .I know a few of you have been anticipating this for a while, but i had to clear it with Gunther and he was on holiday until yesterday.

Background
==========
Basically I have been chasing some sort of engine tuning potential for the car the 2.4 Type-S for well...ever since I got my Accords 6 years ago....you may have read the Hondata thread here...well I chased them..nagged them well basically to deaf ears...you see Hondata is an American company with no interest in the small market share the UK has..they have bigger fish to spend their time on.

Later I found CPL Racing could tune the Accord but that involved a new ECU and a loss of the immobiliser..another no.

Then by accident one day (two months ago) i came across XO POwer Tuning..I honestly do not know how i came across them...emailed them and they said that they can remap the car..and that he'd only got his hands on the tech a few weeks ago. According to my good source (Fahad :)) it has been possible to tune car but it's not worth the effort for people to do it. So basically i jumped on the chance (next day lol) to travel to Northumberland to speak to Gunther.

The Work
========
Arrived and really just wanted to speak to the Gunther to pick his brains really to fully make sure he knew what he was doing...basically i wasn't going to just hand over my car to any so called tuner who is just interested in my money. So spoke to him and yep sure enough he specialises just in japanese cars and
yes he knew the link with the Acura TSX...and tbh that was enough for me....you just know when you're speaking to someone who knows what they are talking about. Negotiated a deal there and then, yes for you guys also (jump to post 2 if that's all you're interested in!), and started the work.

I ripped the ECU out (yes i took all my tools :)), it's in the lower center console, you need to remove the kick panels on driver and passenger side and then the air tubes to get at the bolts. This is an ECU out job and then requires soldering a serial port on the ECU to read the ECU and then resolder to different point to write to it......it's an intensive job and the whole process of removing, refitting, soldering, reading and writing to the ECU takes about 4Hours. The port is removed after work.

Bit of XO Power Tuning background
==========================
Let's be honest you've probably never heard of them, I am from the North East and yes i never knew they were there lol. They specialise in Japanese cars, been around for over 10 years, have just moved to a brand new premises in Cramlington and just about to install their rolling road, they rarely advertise and
most of the work they do is by word of mouth. Has built a 700Bhp Civic and Gunther is an easy going chap.

So there are still good people around who don't feel the need to shout everything on the internet :).

The Remap
=========
I guess this is what you're really interested in. I haven't got the rolling road results yet..will do over the next weeks. So what I say is my personal opinion. Really there is one work FANTASTIC! The 2.4 is a good motor but drive it a while and there are the niggles
1) the laggy DBW expecially when setting off
2) The lack of torque between 4500rpm until 6000rpm when the main corssover kicks in

Let's just say both of these are corrected. There are a few ways of setting the i-Vtec you can have it come on depending on manifold pressure i.e full throttle vtec kicks in (like a mini turbo lol) or have it set to a specific value.
The way i set it was to have the main cross over at 4800rpm (you can shoose what you wish). That way there is torque throughout the rev range and peak power isn't sacrificed.
The DBW always felt that it lagged like you needed to give it juice before raising the clutch..it just felt a but strange, after driving it a while you get used to it but still...The remap corrects this and the pedal is a lot more sensitive....makes setting off at traffic lights a lot smoother.
Overall power delivery is just soo much smoother and stronger, there is no lull in power and pulls all the way to 7500red line....you can actually use 4th to overtake without having to think should i shouldn't i change down...just overall you don't need to work the gears as hard. On the motorway you don't even really need to change from 6th it's that driveable.
If you feel the need to work the gears then yes you'll be in for a big treat. When you first get it done it just feels a different car...you'll have a smile on your face for weeks when you push the pedal(well i did), then after the weeks have passed you just get in the car and can really enjoy the car because it finally drives like how you expected the 2.4 to be in the first place!

Oh and yes the ECU saftey's are still all in place i.e not being able to rev the car over 4500rpm when stationary.

oh and yes it is also available for the 2.0 also..However bear in mind I have no personal experience of this and note also that the 2.0 is quite a lot milder compared to the 2.4. I would suggest you talk to XO before any work.

Fuel Economy
============
If you drive it fast you loose fuel economy simple as lol...drive it sedately it's about the same, you'll probably gain on motorway travel since you don't need to change so often...but really you don't get power for nothing since it's NA (normally aspirated).

well that's it..no more having to chase people for this..it was literally on my door step lol, if you have anymore question you can ask them here or speak to Gunther(see post 2 for contact)

I'll get the rolling road result up when i get them.
 
Basically the going rate for this sort of work is £580 for the 2.4 and £530 (ish) for the 2.0.

Price for TypeAccord is
£480 for the 2.4
£440 for the 2.0

To speak more about the remap you can contact Gunther at Xo Power or telephone 01670739342 or post a message here. :)
 
Alan, can I be the first to congratulate you on this find and securing this fantastic deal for the club.

Just to reinforce what you are saying here, don't compare the pricing to the diesel car pricing. The diesel cars are tunable via the OBD port meaning the actual software writing is a much less involved process and we can pass the savings on.

The process you are describing is comparable to the process we need to follow to tune the latest I-DTEC cars, and for those we also charge upwards of £550.

The club pricing you have secured is an absolute steal, and I know you well enough to know you wouldn't praise something or someone that wasn't worthy of it.

For those of you that have been asking for this for your petrol 7th gen's, time to put your money where your mouth is :)
 
Put me down for one, pm sent
rolleyes.gif
 
Just want to congratulate you for the superb deal that you have achieved for the club, i e-mailed XO last week and Gunther got back to me with a price of £549, so to even get it done after the first 5 members at £480 is a great deal, also great write up on the remap, you have completely whetted my appetite now.
better get the old saving pants on immediately :eek: :(
 
hondawg79 said:
Just want to congratulate you for the superb deal that you have achieved for the club, i e-mailed XO last week and Gunther got back to me with a price of £549, so to even get it done after the first 5 members at £480 is a great deal, also great write up on the remap, you have completely whetted my appetite now.
better get the old saving pants on immediately :eek: :(
Click to expand...

Ditto to the above;)
 
OMG im so excited now its officially available! I've definately added it to my list although i want more engine mods done before hand to make the most of the power upgrade. I will be after this sometime in the new year as the car gets ready for track. Need to get the brembos on first as everythin is already sittin, and my sister is gonna loan me her car so i can remove my own hubs instead of buyin a spare set.

Cant wait to see the results of the dyno session!!! :ph34r:
 
indeed you can dave..just make sure you send it very securely B)
 
Would be interested in this depending on the actual gaining power etc... will await Alans results B)

Also Alan nice work on getting this sorted :(
 
i won;t know the actual power gain of the 2.0 since i have a 2.4 but one things for sure you'll benefit...maybe you can wait to see what Puppy says since he's getting his 2.0 done B)
 
will the 2.4's just get the same chip info burnt thats on your car al? Or will it be suited to each car on their new dyno or road mapped?
 
that is for you to discuss with Gunther as and when you do it...RR tuning will be a totally different thing, the ecu is not on the spot remappable as such, there is no OBD access...it takes a few hours to write to it and that is with it off the car.
 
so is it more like the hondata reflash: one general map to suit all K24's...? Opposed to actually gettin it finely tuned and remapped for your specific car takin your own engine mods into consideration.

Not an issue really, if its like a reflash it wont matter about previous engine mods or not, and i could get this done as soon as funds are available. B) I was under the ***umption it was mapped on the spot (either on the road or dyno) so you would see greater benefits if you have other engine mods first like manifold, exhaust and cams.

The lower crossover is what really interestes me as im so used to having a good 2500rpm worth of vtec from my old b16, will be amazing to get it increased from the oem value on the K24. So i take it 3rd gear really comes alive al? Thats what they say about the tsx hondata reflash in the states
 
Al, superb write up mate, I'm so excited about this now I've read your feedback. I was saving up for something else, but the fund will be for this now.

One question mate, I'm running an AEM induction kit - will this have any bearing on getting the work done?

PM also sent.
 
It's similar to the Hondata but different in that it's much more tuneable...but it's just not a live map since the ECU has to be taken out of the car and manually worked on....ecu out means you can't run the car.

it's not only third that you get a bump in driveability it's all the gears...as I've said in the review 6th is actually more driveable (not a power gear by any means) but you'll find you don;t have to change down to 5th to do anything.

Matt i run a Comptech Icebox it doesn't affect the remap, there is still some adaptability in the ecu to alter mapping parameters.
 
Just to try and shed some light on this, although I'm not familiar with Gunther's work.. in general an ECU remap is a permanent re-write of the ECU's software. This however does not affect the ECU's self learning capabilities.

So to answer Matt's question, the software will be written to new values, but the ECU's learning capabilities will still, over time, adjust to accomodate any minor mods.

Oz does raise some important points regarding engine hardware modifications however. If you are going for serious hardware changes such as cams then sometimes it's better to dyno a vehicle.

In my experience however, a bench tune (not on a dyno) can still accomodate certain variables such as induction kit, decat and manifold and achieve a good tune without putting it on a dyno. Tuning is a skill guys.. there are many companies out there who just 'play' with software, but don't actually know how to 'tune' an engine.

Even with a dyno, there is no guarantee you are getting a good quality tune as the tuning is only as good as the tuner who developed the software. Many companies now offer dyno tuning on standard road cars. What is the point? Do you think Honda put every single car on a dyno when they make it? Nope.

It's basically tuners who want to justify their investment in such expensive gear.. and give customers a false sense of quality. I can tell you it's impossible to tune a stock car from scratch on a dyno in one day. You need continuous testing over a period of time to check for driveability, emissions, consumption, engine stress testing etc.

The only cars that need to go on a dyno are those with serious engine modifications that genuinely require a bespoke tune.

I don't know Gunther, but I can see his approach here is a good one. You are effectively buying into Alnug's investment. He is (and possibly some other donor vehicles) are the test vehicles and once the tune has been perfected, it's ready to go on other cars.
 
Yes of course mate, I know that - it's called quality control.

What I was referring to is a lot of tuning companies that coerce customers with standard road cars into dyno tuning, it's simply not required.
 
John - sorry, forgot to say well done :( Really pleased for ya...
 
Alnug said:
It's similar to the Hondata but different in that it's much more tuneable...but it's just not a live map since the ECU has to be taken out of the car and manually worked on....ecu out means you can't run the car.

it's not only third that you get a bump in driveability it's all the gears...as I've said in the review 6th is actually more driveable (not a power gear by any means) but you'll find you don;t have to change down to 5th to do anything.

Matt i run a Comptech Icebox it doesn't affect the remap, there is still some adaptability in the ecu to alter mapping parameters.
Click to expand...

Perfect, thats all i needed to know. I'm in for one in the new year, brembos first.

John im gonna be callin you all day on saturday, lol!

Good goin dan, will be good to get another K24 opinion too
 
i think Fahad has covered it all now...this is a tune for relatively slight modded car....maybe filter, exhaust etc...BUT once you get into the realms of cam profiling etc..you're out of luck with a remap....

Also on the issue of pics....puppy if it's ok I'll be probably heading there next week possibly Monday when Gov is doing his car, I'll ask for pics then....no reason really....but would save any discomfort with having a stranger asking about photo'ing your work..
 
Alnug said:
i think Fahad heas covered it all now...this is a tune for relatively slight modded car....maybe filter, exhaust etc...BUT once you get into the realms of cam profiling etc..you're out of luck with a remap....

Also on the issue of pics....puppy if it's ok I'll be probably heading there next week possibly Monday when Gov is doing his car, I'll ask for pics then....no reason really....but would save any discomfort with having a stranger asking about photo'ing your work..
Click to expand...
I'm cool with that Al!
 
You sure this Gunter fellow should be working on Hondas, sounds like a BM man!
 
hi all yes F6had is correct.

once the ecu has had a remap . the car will still need to meet set target values ie airfuel target , this will always vary depending on altitude and temperature but the ecu will correct fuel tables to meet the set target air fuel value programed to the ecu so it will self correct so it won run lean or rich, timing advance works on load but it wont self adjust as much as fuel target value. as they are set ,as we have acceleration(high load) timing and fuel tables set wich are just for thrashing you car :wub: so no need to downshift as much to pull away.wich are different to your normal tables for crusing etc.

the ecu can log upto 20min data , we would use this to tune past stage 3 on dyno or too customers specifice requirements with high flow of air or higher compression engine

so to en extent you can live map ( as to live map you need to view logs as data moves so fast and tables switch that its hard to keep up on screen

we can offer for both k20 and k24 stage 1 and 2
stage 1 intake exhaust or stock car
stage 2 intake exhaust header full length header ( not stubby) no cats


F6HAD said:
Just to try and shed some light on this, although I'm not familiar with Gunther's work.. in general an ECU remap is a permanent re-write of the ECU's software. This however does not affect the ECU's self learning capabilities.

So to answer Matt's question, the software will be written to new values, but the ECU's learning capabilities will still, over time, adjust to accomodate any minor mods.

Oz does raise some important points regarding engine hardware modifications however. If you are going for serious hardware changes such as cams then sometimes it's better to dyno a vehicle.

In my experience however, a bench tune (not on a dyno) can still accomodate certain variables such as induction kit, decat and manifold and achieve a good tune without putting it on a dyno. Tuning is a skill guys.. there are many companies out there who just 'play' with software, but don't actually know how to 'tune' an engine.

Even with a dyno, there is no guarantee you are getting a good quality tune as the tuning is only as good as the tuner who developed the software. Many companies now offer dyno tuning on standard road cars. What is the point? Do you think Honda put every single car on a dyno when they make it? Nope.

It's basically tuners who want to justify their investment in such expensive gear.. and give customers a false sense of quality. I can tell you it's impossible to tune a stock car from scratch on a dyno in one day. You need continuous testing over a period of time to check for driveability, emissions, consumption, engine stress testing etc.

The only cars that need to go on a dyno are those with serious engine modifications that genuinely require a bespoke tune.

I don't know Gunther, but I can see his approach here is a good one. You are effectively buying into Alnug's investment. He is (and possibly some other donor vehicles) are the test vehicles and once the tune has been perfected, it's ready to go on other cars.
Click to expand...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top